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iHow this transcript is madeUnGovr transcribes the official recording with automated speech-to-text, separates speakers by voice, and matches voices to the seated roster. Names and attributions are AI estimates and may contain errors.Verify any quote yourself: click anywhere in the transcript and the official video jumps to that exact moment, so you can check any quote against the recording.Scheduled start 6:00 PM · clock-time estimates pending review
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Mayor Sticks? Here. Mayor Pro Tem Weirich?
Yes, here.
Council Member Blatz? Here. Council Member Francina? Here and Council Member Haney is here he's just momentarily stepped out of the room
Agenda Discussionitems moved / continued / pulled — click to expand
And may we have approval of the agenda? Motion to approve?
I would like to make one change to the agenda.
We're pulling L right?
Mayor?
Yes, go
ahead. I'd like to do 2-3 and then do 5-6 and save 4 for last. It seems to me it's going to take the most amount of time. There's a lot to listen to, a lot to look into, just a lot that we need to hear tonight regarding the
housing
element update.
Would you repeat what you just said? What's the order?
So, the order would be 2-3-5-6 and then 4.
It's moving the housing element to last because it would be the... it's going to be the longest discussion.
Right.
Okay. Isn't that also the most public interest? Do we want to do that?
So as far as comments received, we've received one
Okay, okay.
I think we've received two comments. The list shows one but i think there was a second one so we haven't received a whole lot of comments for item four yet.
Okay I'm fine with that.
Fine with me? All right uh second for that? I'll second.
As soon as they can second it.
Okay maybe the roll call please Gail.
Thank you, all right we have a presentation tonight uh we will be welcoming the Ventura County District Attorney Eric Nasarenko and congratulations to him on his recent election and James would you like to introduce him please
yeah just thank you just I'll give a brief introduction Eric was appointed unanimously by the Board of Supervisors as the District Attorney for the County of Ventura in January of this year. You may recognize his name because before that he also served as a mayor and council member for the city of Ventura. And so with his appointment as the DA, Mr. Nazarenko and I have been talking about scheduling a presentation and thankfully Mr. Nazarenko was able to attend tonight. So with that, I will hand over the floor to our district attorney Eric Nazarenko.
Thank you very much City Manager Vega and it's a pleasure to be before the Ojai City Council. Nice to meet all of you virtually, hello to Mayor Sticks, Mayor Pro Tem Weyrich, the Ojai City Council, of course City Manager Vega and I'd also like to acknowledge the partnership and ongoing collaboration between the Office of the District Attorney and the Ventura County Sheriff's Department, specifically through your chief, Chief Rivera. I wanna spend just about five, seven minutes if I can to talk about the victim services that are available to Ojai residents and your constituents. Specifically we have a Family Justice Center which is right across from the Ventura County Medical Center.
And that Family Justice Center is a one-stop shop for victims in all of Ventura County. Specifically, victims can go to the Family Justice Center and receive counseling. They can receive referrals to therapy. They can get help with civil legal matters. They can get assistance with completing medical reimbursement forms for hospital bills and the like, they can also receive assistance with the completion of restraining orders to restrain abusers from coming within telephonic or physical contact of them. It's also a one-stop shop for a number of government and nonprofit entities. Coalition for Family Harmony, Interface, the Child Protective Service, the County Agency on Aging And I mentioned this because we want this to be a resource to all of the Ojai Valley, and obviously the city of Ojai.
Let me give to you if I may just a glimpse of who in the Ojai Valley in the last two years has used the Family Justice Center. This may be of interest to you as elected officials and government leaders. So for roughly the last two years 140 residents of the Ojai Valley have used the Family Justice Center. Predominantly they were female, about 71%. 69% of those were identified as white or Caucasian, 24% as Latinx. The vast majority fell within the age ranges of 25 to 70 and here are the services that they sought when they went to the Family Justice Center The vast majority or 73% sought some type of restraining order. 13% wanted to speak to an advocate or a counselor, 2% wanted some type of safety planning that is some type of shelter housing something away from the home wherein they had been abused and then another 4% sought civil legal services The vast majority of these Ojai residents had indeed spoken to a member of law enforcement, that is they had called 911.
Perhaps they had spoken through a police report to a member of law enforcement or had a field identification card filled out in fact 82%. What's most telling For us, it's just the nature of intimate partner violence and the fact that oftentimes what we see in the criminal justice system are people who are known to one another. That is the offender and the victim specifically 95% of those 140 from the Ojai Valley who went to the Family Justice Center knew the alleged perpetrator 13% stated that the perpetrator was the spouse. 31% identified the perpetrator as someone whom they were dating. Another 33% identified the perpetrator as someone who lived in the household or was a family member, And 18% said it was somebody that was related to their family, not necessarily in the household.
So I mentioned this because I want to make this available as a resource to all of your constituents and we take at the Family Justice Center Monday through Friday walk-ins as well as appointments Constituents and those in the Ojai Valley can text, they can call or they can email to receive these services and get linked to a victim advocate, to a counselor or one of the other entities. And I'd like to just take a moment and share with you that information now it's most common in our generation for people to text and that text is 805-947 7981 again, in order to visit the Family Justice Center. You don't need an appointment although it's preferable but always feel free to call in advance Monday through Friday from 730 to five and you can call the reception line 805-652-7655 or as I mentioned before, the text number 80594779 Something that's exciting and it's on the horizon that I want to share with all of you.
We understand that oftentimes when somebody is at Ventura County Medical Center, they walk across the street to our Family Justice Center. They may need a restraining order help with reimbursement of medical expenses but they also need housing. They can't go back obviously to an abusive situation so if you have been to the Family Justice Center or have kind of Seeing it from across the street at the hospital, you'll notice that there is a building in the back parking lot. I'm very proud to say that thanks to the Ventura County Community Foundation and the Family Justice Center, namely the chief deputy who oversees it Michael jump. We are going to be converting that building in the back of the Family Justice Center to short term housing for domestic violence survivors.
We anticipate with the help of the Ventura County Community Foundation, 14 total beds. There will be approximately eight beds within the existing structure, and then the foundation has committed to these tiny pallet homes which will also be in the parking area. We're going to have to Redo portions of the parking lot. Obviously this will be a secure facility that will be monitored by security guard given the nature of those who are staying there, but it's just an opportunity to prevent the cycle of crime from continuing to give victims an opportunity to be someplace safe and away from the psychological, mental and physical abuse of the perpetrator.
And also the idea here is we're going to allow them to be there from
Roll call — called by Unidentified speaker 1 · 1 under review
Show transcript
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7-15 days that's kind of the duration of stay But thereafter, and during that seven to 15 days we want to help identify supportive housing that they can transition into so very excited about that opportunity. We anticipate breaking ground in the spring of 2022 And I just want to leave the Ojai City Council and the viewers in the Ojai Valley with Camp Hope. You may not be aware of it, I believe just in my bones that obviously we have a fundamental responsibility to keep the county safe, to prosecute those who violate the law and to hold offenders accountable but we also have an ongoing duty and responsibility to prevent crime so we don't have additional victims in the future And towards that end, Mike jumped the chief deputy that I mentioned in the Family Justice Center Foundation.
Every year send about 25 to 30 children and teenagers ages 717 To the San Bernardino National Forest, and they were there last month engaging in ropes courses campfires stargazing kayaking paddleboarding. And it was a transformative experience these are Teenagers and children who have either experienced physical or sexual abuse, or they have witnessed it in their household. And the idea is to empower them with a life changing experience. Some of them have never been out of Ventura County. But what I'm proud to mention to the Ojai City Council and the viewers is that we don't want this just to be a one-week camp. We had a student volunteer from MIT who was successful in securing grants from that university, and those grants are allowing the Family Justice Center They continue to have engagement, personal and virtual visits with the Camp HOPE attendees with the aspiration that they go on to college.
That's the funding source from MIT. It's called the Pathways Program. And the notion is you give them one week of a transformative experience but then on a monthly basis thereafter you work with them, you engage them You put them on a college pathway, you introduce doctors, lawyers and other positive role models in their life. And you just go ahead and show them that there are alternatives out there and they can take advantage of them and that we're here to assist in that endeavor. So I leave you with hope and that's Camp Hope, and I'm very grateful for the opportunity to speak to all of you, to share with you the Family Justice Center, and please encourage those that you serve and that you lead to visit in the event that they are indeed in search of some sort of intervention and support.
Thank you.
Beautiful, well I just want to say thank you so much Eric for the beautiful work that you're doing and it sounds I mean Camp Hope and the Pathways program sound amazing. And particularly thank you for helping all those women in particular 71% who really need help and providing housing for them and a pathway away from violence is just incredible resource for our community so thank you very much.
Thank you Mayor Stixx
Susan say something? I want to echo what Mayor Six just said. Again, I assume that there's a website in English and Spanish would that be if people Google Family Justice Center would they then have access to this information that you just shared with us?
They would. Councilwoman, there are several Family Justice Centers statewide. I believe there are 24 total so in that Google search query make sure you put Family Justice Center Ventura County but in terms of just reaching out if I may can I share with you the email address in the event anyone wants to email? vcfjc.coopadventura.org again, vc f j c dot c o p adventura.org and I'm happy city manager Vega to follow up with you tomorrow just to make sure that I provided a lot of numbers and uh you know an email address in that way you'll have it at the ready
yeah that'd be great we'll definitely pass it along
bill Such an important effort, a couple of quick questions. We've heard a lot of publicity about nationwide global trends of these kinds of problems being exasperated by the COVID experience especially lockdowns. I was wondering if you saw any statistical evidence of that in terms of when people don't have the ability to get away basically they end up being more victims and then the other point I wanted to make was You mentioned college at Camp Hope, but I'm on the board for a scholarship committee for Rotary here in Ojai that we were very successful with. But we're definitely engaging in the more granular and diverse ways that people have life-changing career opportunities and not necessarily traditional college. And so if somebody is particularly prone to maybe something that's not traditional college but nevertheless very equally valuable, I would hope that opportunity other than traditional four-year college would be available for them.
Yes, in the order of your questions and thank you Mayor Pro Tem we saw an exponential increase in need for restraining orders particularly shortly after the onset of the pandemic and during the period of lockdown. In fact it was over a hundred percent from year over year And you know, another casualty of COVID. When kids aren't in school, a teacher may not see that bruise or the counselor is not available to give the disclosure. So the isolation frankly in many instances that we've seen this as anecdotal obviously makes it difficult for children to come forward to report crimes, to identify their abusers And that too is a trend that we saw during the pandemic. To your second question, and it's a valid one, I don't mean to in any way minimize vocational training.
It's integral and important but I'll share with Council and Mayor Pro Tem Weirich MIT is the funder here and it's there. I understand. Yeah, you know it's there and part of what I didn't mention before in my remarks is the grant that this MIT student identified is specific to help minority students 10 universities and colleges. So in a way, you know we follow the funding and I don't want to in any way minimize the importance of vocational in the crafts especially but right now the pathway is towards universities because that's how the grant has been structured.
Right. The goal should be allowing individuals to succeed You know, sometimes that's more complicated than just traditional four-year. But anyway it's all a good program
absolutely. Yeah thank you agreed yeah
and I just want to say thank you for all the wonderful work this office is doing I think D.A. Ostranko has done a fantastic job since he's been in, so I appreciate it and I'm in the family court frequently enough to know how this increase has happened during COVID and all the different things that there's been a lot going on in the courthouse district attorney's office on Not just this issue, but a lot trying to keep the justice and keep the wheels on the bus during this very complicated time. But this is one of those really great programs that it's nice to see the progressive nature of our district attorney's office or sheriff department and others really trying to say there's There's more thoughtful, complicated not always easy to implement but better ways to deal with it than just the book, the law and restraining orders.
And this is part of it especially on a victim side that tends to be a little bit neglected overall in the justice system victims tend to be sometimes you know not the focal point of where all the attention is so I just Just wanna say thank you and I hope you're bringing this to all the city's attention, but especially up here where a little bit more remote from the county facilities. It's really important for people to know that these services are available and if you're in Ohio and these things happen, you have somewhere to go.
Yeah, I really appreciate the comments council member. Hopefully by the end of this month we'll have spoken to all 10 city councils in the County of Ventura But thereafter, I intend to go to the school districts as well. Because I think when you serve as elected officials in both the educational and the municipal capacity this is a message that you'll want to take to those that you serve.
And then to your point about COVID, I'll just give you one statistic We have managed since the onset of the pandemic, March of 2020 to conduct about 54 jury trials. So as you know Council Member Blatz a lot goes into a jury trial social distancing mask wearing now to give you sort of some perspective in a typical year we will have conducted more than 200. So, you know the wheels of justice are still moving albeit slower. I think that's necessary given this public health crisis but we're still continuing to bring jurors in we're still continuing i believe to administer justice and uh i hope there will be a day soon where we can ramp back up to what we once were and engage in jury trials on a more regular basis. I
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have a quick question Eric I believe the national average for sexual assault is one third of women, one out of three. Is that true in our county also? Do you know?
Yeah, it's but I've seen two statistics. They typically place sexual assaults of females between 25 and 33%. You're absolutely right Mayor. I don't have at my disposal some statistic with respect to our County But I was somewhat negligent in my initial remarks. The Family Justice Center is intended for vulnerable, sensitive victims specifically those who are sexually assaulted Those who experience elder abuse, those children who experienced some type of physical abuse women and men who are victims of domestic violence. And then recently thanks to our chief deputy uh and others on the family justice board we expanded the Family Justice Center to those victimized by hate crimes I wanted to just mention that as well um you know In an ideal world with plenty and ample funding, we'd be able to serve all victims of crime irrespective of what type of crime took place.
But the Family Justice Center really has its specialization in assisting women and in assisting children.
Thank you. Any other questions? Randy?
I wasn't sure if you could see me. You know the my experience in this environment? It's the follow up or the follow through, which to me is the most important aspect. You're the front door. Which allows the victim to enter and to be counseled and to be cared for it and to be understood and more importantly At the end of their 14 days, are we handing them off to another county entity that's going to see them through whatever means or needs that they have? And do you have any of those facilities or names or entities at your fingertips?
Sure, I mean I can think of a couple offhand. You know rain is one of them the city center is another you know if they are unhoused turning point but to your point Council Member Haney it is something that is a work in progress because you need to have a plan during those 7-15 days for where they go next. One of the efforts that we undertake is family reunification. And you see it oftentimes in law enforcement and it's a successful model, not always but in some instances where you reach out to loved ones that have some contact and familiarity with the victim And you basically at the behest of the victim say, hey can you go ahead and house this person in a system? They're going through an abusive relationship right now. They have a lengthy court process and they'll need your help.
So we have undertaken that endeavor but more needs to be done in terms of where we transition them to after they get out of the short term domestic violence housing.
Thank you.
Well, thank you so much Eric for coming. Really grateful to you and all the work that you do. So wonderful to meet you.
Thank you. Yeah likewise I look forward to meeting all of you in person soon.
Thank you. Bye
bye. Thank you again.
Um well we're going to move uh we need to take the redistricting item as the first time to satisfy state requirements for the public hearing in the fair map act. So we'll move to number two Well, we have to do this first,
Sousa. I'm happy to cover that one. I apologize for not catching it earlier but we took a deep look at the Fair Maths Act and it requires that we offer public hearings on the redistricting at a time certain in this case the time certain is right after the DA's presentation so my recommendation is take that up then go in the regular order from there. And for the next three hearings, we'll cover this by listing a precise start time for the redistricting item for the next three hearings likely at 7 30 or so.
I'm sorry mayor i didn't catch all that. We're moving to number two because of time?
Because of what Matt just said, did you catch that?
The underlying issue is state law requires that we offer the redistricting hearings at a precise time. And so the closest time we could get to the start of the meeting having not listed a precise time on the agenda is this moment. So the recommendation is to move item two up and then take the remainder in the order previously ordered. Then general comment, then consent. Then three, five, six and close with four.
Okay? So item number two the first city council redistricting public hearing will receive input from residents regarding the communities of interest and receive the report. So this is the first of five public hearings between now and March. So we'll officially open the public hearing and James, you have a presentation for us?
Yeah. Thank you. And James, Han or Gail if you can let our redistricting partner into the meeting I'll just give a brief introduction there's going to be a presentation A few months back, the council approved a contract with redistricting partners who is also running the County of Ventura's current redistricting process and several other agencies. So we have a representative from redistricting partners today here to give an overview on the process and some of the upcoming steps.
I believe Sophia is attending on redistricting partner's behalf So I'll hand it off to her in a minute. But just to answer a couple of quick questions that people may be having watching, I know one question is probably didn't we just do this? And the answer to that question is unfortunately yes. We had gone through the districting process in 2018 but because the census data We went through that process because of potential legal challenges when there were challenges throughout the state, challenging cities to move to districting systems. We moved into it at that point but because the new census data comes out in 2020 we then have to redistrict following that census data And so that census data is now out and available, and we're reviewing it.
And so we are working to redistrict. So this should hopefully be the redistricting that takes place for this census cycle. And so with that I want to hand it off to Sophia from Redistricting Partners who will walk us through a quick presentation with the goal of holding a public hearing and receiving input from the community. Sophia, I'll hand it to you.
Thank you. Can you hear me James?
Yep.
Okay. I'm going to share my screen. Are you able to see the beginning of our presentation?
Yeah.
Perfect. Wonderful. Hi everyone. My name is Sophia Garcia. I am the GIS and Outreach Director with Redistricting Partners And so we are the firm that will be working with you throughout this process. Throughout the process, you'll see myself or other colleagues of mine and as James mentioned, the Fair Maps Act otherwise known as AB 849 is a bill that cities and counties across the state have to follow. So we're gonna get into that a little bit throughout their presentation but he's correct and as a part of that law they redistricting Conversation has to be at a time certain spot on your agenda, and that allows for the public to be able to call in at a specific time and give their input. So we're going to
get started. Is this when the Spanish interpreter was going to participate or am I confused?
They are available if anybody requests an interpreter. At this point, we have not received any request.
Thank you. Sorry to interrupt, sorry.
No worries. Yeah. Okay. So this is the redistricting 101 presentation and we have to start with what is redistricting? And so redistricting as the process of adjusting district lines every 10 years after the release of the US census. As James said, the census was just released. The numbers were just released actually a couple weeks ago And if it was a normal census year, we would have gotten that data at the end of March. But because this is not a normal couple of years and really not a normal census year, we just got that data a few weeks ago. And so we're in a really compressed timeline for the state across the country. A lot of cities and counties have a very compressed timeline. So normally, yes it does occur every 10 years. Some of the well-known examples that the public may be aware of are congressional and state legislative.
And in California we have a citizen redistricting commission that is in charge of drawing and finalizing our congressional and legislator lines. Within the U.S., redistricting has become an extremely politicized process And has been the subject of more high profile Supreme Court decisions than any part of our election systems. As James mentioned as well, in California we have the California Voting Rights Act which has opportunity for members of the public to ask their jurisdiction to move from an at-large to a districted system which sounds that you all did that a couple years ago so it's been in the public conscious a lot the past couple of years this process Districting and now redistricting.
So the city of Ojai redistricting, some of the structure for the city. The redistricting is completed by the City Council as you all hear with us this evening. And the Fair Maps Act again also known as AB 849 requires at least four public hearings for outreach to the community And that all information be made public and available online. So all of the redistricting information, presentations content any maps that have been submitted by the public any of the community of interest testimony will be online at the city of Ojai redistricting website. And that website will actually be maintained by the city for 10 years. So you can kind of wave and say hi to your redistricting folks who will be doing this in a decade Because the city will have to maintain all that information.
Some other things that the city will be doing, it'll be working with staff and the council is the process will include community outreach hearings again a part of that for hearing structure. There'll be multiple ways for the public to submit community of interest input and we'll go through a couple of those this evening. And multiple draft maps will be submitted for the opportunity for the public to comment So there is a requirement for the final map that's gonna be adopted, that that be placed in the public seven days prior. So we're gonna work with staff to try to get as many of those maps that you guys will be discussing ahead of time so that the public will have an opportunity to review them and when you're in these public meetings hopefully you'll have a robust discussion and comments from members of the public.
So some traditional redistricting principles that are gonna help guide the process And will also be in ranked criteria order for the council to consider. Okay, yeah I have my dogs at another room. If you hear barking on my part we've got three doggos in the house.
We're used to it.
Yeah okay, a benefit from working from home but also they can come unexpected on call. But these traditional redistricting principles are also here to help prevent a districting from becoming a gerrymander. There are a number of criterias that have been used nationally and upheld by the courts. Again, these are in ranked criteria order so the council has federal law to consider state law, the new Fair Maps Act and then these guiding principles as you guys are looking at draft maps and then finalizing a plan. So the first one is relatively equal size. And when we're talking about the redistricting, that the city council districts there to try to make them as relatively equal size as possible and when we're talking about size, we're talking about people not citizens again for this, we are using census data and for the census data that captured total population of people.
There is some room but you can have a total deviation of 10% between the highest And the lowest populated district. So that is allowable so that you're able to consider all the other criterias when you're looking at your draft maps and finalizing a plan. Contiguous or contiguity is one of those terms that kind of only come around once a decade, and that's the concept that your district shouldn't hop or jump over an area. So if you can kind of think of a game of checkers or the game of twister, you don't want to hop over an area or kind of have it in multiple corners of your district.
Maintaining communities of interest is a guiding principle that has really been highlighted throughout this process in 2021, and we're going to get more into that in the later slides. And it's also the third ranked criteria in the Fair Maps Act, and the Fair Maps Act also has a lot of opportunity but kind of uplifts the community's availability to make comment and opportunity to do And so maintaining communities of interest is one of those things that if the council hears a lot of testimony or wants to maintain an area together, that's again why you have that 10% deviation room to play with.
You can also follow existing neighborhood lines. If that's something that the council wants to consider or other kind of government lines that they'd like to see to help them guide that process of redistricting And then keep districts compact. And when we're talking about compactness, that can be in two forms. One's an appearance and in function. So kind of thinking how functionally people move through the city of Ojai.
And again if just because a district it looks like a funny shape doesn't necessarily mean that it is a gerrymander. This is to why compactness is lower ranked on this list because you have all these other criterias to look at. In California, the definition of compactness is to not bypass nearby population for far away population. So if there's an area that is kind of close to the district that you're looking to construct and you want to go and bypass it to grab a portion of another district, that's not really allowable now under state laws but that kind of helps and gives us a definition for compactness. So these are the guiding redistricting principles that we're going to follow when we're going And the criteria that the council will have to look to when drawing their maps.
So a lot of this presentation now is focused on the concept of communities of interest, and communities of interest is also a term that kind of only comes up once a decade. But what it really means is understanding that in this redistricting process we know that residents of the city of Ojai are experts of their community. You on the council know your community very well And so it's kind of taking knowing your community, how you move through your community, how you interact with the council, but putting in redistricting terms.
So communities of interest for the purpose of redistricting is about bringing like-minded people together for representation. A community of interest can include ethnic and language minorities and other groups. Some groups that are covered under the Voting Rights Act are Latinos, Asians, and African Americans However, while race is a community of interest, it cannot be a predominant factor in drawing districts unless there is a Voting Rights Act district and legal counsel will guide us through that process.
Again, while we understand that race is a community of interest, a lot of us recognize our race and kind of think of that as a big part of who we are. In the redistricting process if there's not a Voting Rights Act district, it cannot be the predominant factor In drawing districts. So we have some guiding questions to help members of the public think through when they're giving public testimony, um, to not just think about their race, but kind of think of the other common bonds that bind their communities together.
Um, so the three kinds of things to think through in terms of giving your community of interest testimony and sort of thinking through that, um ,the city council will be looking for this when they're judging the kind of testimony that's written, that's verbal, that's given through maps. It's given through paper maps. They're going to again think about the community in terms of their redistricting process and so one thing to think through is what is the shared culture characteristic or bond of your community? Kind of what are the reasons why you think of your community together Once you've thought of that, because redistricting is about mapping it is about geography. At the end of the day there will be a council district plan for the city of Ojai asking yourself what is the geography of your community?
Of course if you're gonna give us a map whether that's an online map or paper map we'll be able to see that geography but if you're giving written or verbal testimony it's really helpful to think through the street boundaries of your neighborhood or community If there's specific locations that you think are really important and to vocalize that or write back.
Because I, redistricting partners we don't want to misinterpret what a member of the public is saying so again it's really helpful if you give us that geographic information. And then third to think through what is the relationship to the agency? So in this instance what is the community's relationship to the City Council of the city of Ojai? So are there things that you would feel you'd be better represented if your specific community was kept together? Or if right now, if your community is split, if that's causing you to put more work in to talk to your representative. This is kind of the format or guideline to think about your community in terms of the redistricting process.
So again, thinking about that in another way and putting it in the form of three questions Does the community have a shared culture, characteristic or bond? Is the community geographic in nature? Can it be mapped? And how would you describe your community's relationship to the jurisdiction and how is it affected by policy decisions made by elected officials. Again these sort of thought questions are here to help guide the residents and community as they're giving their testimony.
Some examples of communities of interest, it can include a really vast variety of things. Communities of interest they're subjective and we're talking about people's relationship to the city, a place that they know very well. And so we want members of the public and the council to remain open-ended and kind of just listen to what the residents are gonna say. And some examples could be People living near industry, so like farming, agriculture.
There could be senior citizens or students if you have a downtown area versus a rural area, urban or agriculture, or homeowners or renters. So that's just some examples of what some communities of interest can be. Under the Fair Maps Act and in this redistricting cycle There are also some things that are not allowable to be considered as communities of interest. Again, this presentation and the Fair Maps Act and the criteria are all here to help prevent a district from becoming a gerrymander. And so under the Fair Maps Act there's three things that are explicitly prohibited from being considered as a community of interest. Those are political party affiliation, incumbency, and political candidates We know that members of the public will come forward and give testimony.
And it is people's right to speak to their folks who represent them, their elected officials but it's the job of the council to sift through that community of interest testimony and sort of see what they're allowed to use which you guys are allowed to use to consider when drafting maps and finalizing a plan. So again, the three things that are not allowable to be considered as community of interest Our political party affiliation, incumbency or political candidates.
Another thing for members of the public to kind of think about when they're giving their testimony it is really hard to map or consider groups of similarly minded people who do not share a geographic location. So if there is a community of interest that says my community of interest is the whole city of Ojai That's really difficult, again because we're talking about a redistricting process. So we're talking about splitting up the city and so we encourage those people who come with that testimony to think about if there is a portion of the city that you have pockets or concentration or if there are hot spots or kind of think through beyond the city what their specific areas and neighborhoods that you consider as a community of interest.
So those are just another thing to think through, again because we're talking about districting. Additional redistricting rules, again under the Fair Maps Act. Again not to consider incumbents or candidates, to not draw districts to advantage or disadvantage political party, to hold a minimum set number of hearings to encourage public engagement And as mentioned earlier, posting of all redistricting commission information on the website that is maintained for the next 10 years.
So this was a law that was passed in 2019 and a lot of advocates, community advocates across the country advocated for this law to be passed and the process to make the process more transparent and to make it to where more folks can have the opportunity to their representatives. So these are some of the additional criteria that will be followed for the city and counties across the state.
More additional redistricting roles are, the Fair Maps Act also requires cities and counties to use a revised data set for population. That is the statewide database is tasked with reallocating state prison population to their residency prior to incarceration And we expect that that final data set will be available at the end of September. So we have the final 2020 census data, but to... The city will have to then use the statewide database data that moves our incarcerated population from state prisons and puts them at their last known residency. And so in some cities and counties, that's not gonna have a lot of movement But we may have, you know, a couple or 100 like additional residents that will be a part of the final data set for the City of Ojai.
So that is again another additional thing that the city will have to consider. So there's quite a few ways for the communities to submit testimony. Again, you're welcome to attend one of these meetings. There's multiple points throughout this agenda I see for the opportunity to give comment Another way is to submit the community of interest worksheet, which should be on the website on the City of Ojai redistricting website. We're also in the process of finalizing having a districter as part of another way that the city can submit testimony. I think we're hoping to get that at the end of the week if not early next week and this is an online mapping tool that is widely used by jurisdictions across the state and even across the country.
In 2011, all my mapping tools weren't really something that were widely available and actually at Redistricting Partners we love going in person, we love doing community workshops and having paper maps and talking with residents but And the kind of environment that we're in with COVID and the Delta variant, and a lot of meetings being hybrid. This is a really wonderful option, and we've seen it's very user-friendly, intuitive, and as soon as it's up, we see a lot of residents from other jurisdictions using it right away. So that is a really exciting tool, and I'm really happy that this city went with that one.
Again just as a reminder, this is, We have this up, these questions up a lot because we know that the redistricting process only happens once every 10 years. So we're going to work hard to try to make sure that your city doesn't have to redistrict again for another 10 years and so these kind of questions are there to sort of help folks try to be a part of the process and give testimony about the city can use.
This is the redistricting website. So it's ohi.ca.gov slash redistricting dash, and so you have a lot of information. You see that there are maps prominent there, background information and information on upcoming meetings. So that is a really great resource to look at. And that is the presentation. Yes, I will stop sharing my screen. And then I see Susan's hand is up
0:50 – 1:0326 turns
And if I could hop in with two final comments before questions from Council. Mayor? Sure, of course thank you. One of the things that I think Ms. Garcia covered really well but i want to emphasize is the Fair Maps Act has changed the game regarding how maps have to be drawn since the current maps were drawn in 2018. So the reality is we're going to be looking at maps that may be similar but will not be the same as the current four maps or four districts one map, four districts so I want folks to sort of have that in mind the community members the public Those on council, bear that in mind. The Fair Maps Act as laid out by Ms. Garcia has really changed the situation and we're going to see maps that are gonna look a little bit different or significantly different as the council may decide.
The second big thing to bear in mind is that in order to show without question that we are not considering incumbency, the redistricting partners team has not been told and will not be told where the council members live. They do not have an information, therefore they cannot consider that information as they're drawing the maps. So that's also how we're going to protect the process should anyone come along to challenge it that we haven't considered incumbency and I've met the Fair Map Act requirements but everything else is fair game.
And so with that, I think we're available for any questions from council and the public. Thank you. Thanks Matt.
Well, you did answer my first two questions because the current map is based on where the incumbents lived. Am I correct?
The current map took into account as part of many factors where the incumbents lived at the time and that was lawful because before we were allowed to consider incumbency as one of several factors as part of maintaining a continuity of government. Now we can't.
Okay, so the burning question is what happens to the incumbents? And then my other question is will Ms. Garcia or Sophia if we can call you that, will you be with us for the next five meetings?
I'll let her answer that one first and then I'll cover the second.
Just to clarify that, so it's not the next five meetings but we do have five public hearings scheduled over the next six months?
That's what i
meant
yeah. So will you be with us through the whole process or is there always going to be a mapping representative or whatever the title is?
Yes, yeah. So it'll be either myself or a member of the redistricting partners team but we will be monitoring and we're presenting at all of the city meetings or if you have outreach hearings we'll be monitoring those as well. As part of our process when we draft maps for you will be to consider the community of interest testimony and so we'll be monitoring listening to that at all of the meetings yes.
So you're aware that we're a 4.4 mile city, and a lot of the things that I covered could be wrong don't really apply because we're so small. And so my question is couple of the council members are renters and my house was just sold. And as it stands now, I can only move into a very small area known as District 4. So all of this that's taking place, is this for the 2022 election? Like will the current council members...I'm the only council member that has run That has, in the last election had to run in a very small pool of people like 700 people district four. Very small pool are you following what I'm saying?
So there's another election in 2022 will that impact if the incumbents decide to run how does that work? Are they going to be moved out of their current district for this next election or how does that all work? Is that a clear, what I'm asking?
Yes. Yeah. That's it. That's the question we get pretty like almost at every meeting. So as Matt mentioned, we won't be considering incumbency when we're drawing maps but at the end of the process when you all finalize a plan, we will then... You will all kind of decide If there is one or more incumbents who are in the same district, then you'll decide kind of what the order of the next election will be. And I'll just start off with saying that during this process if there are multiple incumbents in a district, you won't shorten your term.
So if there is- And no one's term
is likely to be extended either. It's going to be the same... So what will happen is The districts that come out of the process will have Council Member Francina, you're in office through elected 2020. You're in office through 2024. Your term will not be shortened it cannot be shortened. The other three members of council you're elected 18 through 22. You're up for reelection next year if you choose to run again those terms will be four-year terms sorry I didn't mean to cut you off there Ms. Garcia but wanted to make that point real plain
Yeah. No, yeah. Thank you. So if there is so then once you are in the districts if your when your term is up and you're still in a district with an incumbent then you will have to run against one another but only until your term has expired. Does that make sense?
And the likely outcome, if I could add a little more here. The likely outcome given the fact that we have Council Member Francina is in District 4 which is roughly south of the avenue with a little bit to the north and then the other three districts are split one two three sort of west to east north of the avenue with the pinwheel in the middle around downtown um we may end up with pairings and if the pairing However the pairing ends up, everyone on council right now keeps their seats.
What we'll control is next time. If we end up with a situation where a pair is off cycle then that's when we'll sort out the precise order. So if for example, district four and current district three or two ended up together those two council members ended up together. That's Bill and Francine. If you end up in the same pair Then Francina stays on council. Bill has to run, would have to run again at 22 and then Sousa stays on council representing the districts probably four and then Bill has to run again but so no one leaves office what we have to sort out though is the precise order for if two people are paired that means one district doesn't have anyone elected from it And that's what would then likely take the next seat that's up, would be that seat.
The district that doesn't have anyone living in it, that's the one that would run. So let's say in this example and this is hypothetical example but it's illustrative of the rule. If Susan and Bill end up paired and the lines are drawn such that no one lives in the remainder of District 4 Then Sousa keeps her seat through 24 and 2024. And Bill's seat would then become the District 4 seat that would then be up next time.
It's all a bit hypothetical at this point, but the key thing is to bear in mind no one loses office early. Everyone remains in office. No terms are extended or shortened. Everyone's terms are exactly as they are now on the current cycles And the other thing to bear in mind right now is noted Council Member Francina in District 4 was elected from a district and must continue to be within the district with the 30-day buffer.
The other three were elected at large, the last legacy seats so right now those three members can live anywhere in the city but come the 2022 election we'll be running from districts and will have to live in the districts as the mapping may shake out.
So may I say something else? Yeah, go ahead. Currently correct me if i'm wrong all five council members including the mayor live uh west of Ojai Avenue am I wait they live on north north north of Ojai Avenue
I believe that is currently correct, yes.
Yes and three of us live within a block of each other. That is correct.
I foresee
an interesting outcome to all of
this. And that's why I really let off with the warning the maps will look different than they did now and we are likely to end up with some paired districts. Paired meaning two members of council living in the same district. That's given the fact that three members of council live within a block of each other and that block is a census block Um, we're likely to end up with some pairing. So we want to set the tone there and set the expectation.
And you know it's not the first time this has happened in cities history of California redistricting. For lack of a better phrase, it is what it is. Folks should be aware of it and in order to be mindful of this possibility and the obvious implications thereof that is in part why we've walled off redistricting partners from knowing this. They know the general information but they don't know the details and we're not going to give them the details. In particular they're not going to be told where each council member lives that way they can't have bear that in mind as they do with the maps
Interesting. Thank you, thank you.
Randy?
So I just, based on all the comments that I receive, we at one time were five council members at large with a rotational mayor position. So if that was still in place, we'd have five council districts not four Yes. When we went to the elected mayor, that position now is at large and we have four council districts. Would it be beneficial at this time? And when I say beneficial it's cost effective.
Would we while we're doing this want to look at five districts versus four In the event that we revert back from the elected mayor position to all five being at large. I just, I'm looking at it just cost in the fact that if the citizens and I'm looking at the cost of having to actually go through a redistricting mechanism then versus if we're doing it now, does that affect us if we create five and still keep the mayor's seat at large knowing that if we ever did revert back that we have the five districts already laid out?
Is that illogical logical or not worth talking about?
A couple of responses. As noted, of course returning to an appointed mayor is a decision only the voters can make and that would have to be vote of the people on the underlying question The city could draw both sets of maps four and five now, but it would not relieve us from the obligation should the voters choose to return to a five council member slot. I believe we would still need to go through the hearing process then although the map would already exist so theoretically the council could readopt it with further public comment It may save some money, but I don't believe it eliminates the second round of hearings. I believe that would still be required because redistricting has to be done every 10 years upon the census and when the number of districts changes as would be the case if we were switched from four to five.
But of course, if a map is set at five already existed, it would put us ahead of the game, but it doesn't eliminate entirely because of that element of state law.
It would only expedite it because you wouldn't have to go through the numbers game again.
1:03 – 1:1012 turns
Right, then a draft set of maps would exist but we would still need to go through
the hearing process. You'd still have to hold public hearings and you would still have to do the same process that we're going to do right now. It's just that we wouldn't have to be going through the actual zones or the actual district allocations because we had them.
Right, although we would have to still take the comment. I would suggest that council obviously up to council majority no maps are being drawn tonight so if there's interest in looking at drawing five maps, we could add that as an... If there's a second, we could add that as a component of the agenda item for the next redistricting item to get council direction on whether when we graduate drawing draft maps, we draw four or five But I wouldn't, we couldn't make a decision or council not me. Council could not make a decision on that tonight. It would have to be added to that next item.
And just to clarify Matt on Randy's question if the public decided they wanted to go back to the rotating mayor that still that would have to be on the ballot in 2022 and we'd still need one more mayor, one more two year elected mayor in order to change so that would be 2024 correct?
Correct, with one caveat. The question of returning to a appointed mayor can also be on a special election if the council so chose. If the council did that then it would be possible to have that resolved before the November 2022 election. Although I will note the last two times this subject was on the ballot it was on a regular election ballot first in 14 and then again in 18 in word on the regular ballot in 22, then yes it would not take effect until 24.
And 18 and 2018 the public decided not to keep it elected? Keep the
mayor? Yes that is correct. In 2014 the public created the elected mayor position took effect in 2016 and then in 2018 the public was asked to reconsider the question and decided to keep the elected mayor by a pretty resounding vote if I remember correctly
Okay, thank you. Any other questions, Bill?
Yes, I think there's probably a question for Mr. Summers. We all know that about the Santa Monica decision in the appeals court that the Supreme Court said was not going to be part of case law but then they've decided, I'm being a little cynical here, decided to basically buy inaction not make a decision. I mean, nothing seems to happen except more and more amicus briefs in the case for months and months and months.
Is it your anticipation? Well, that's a twofold question Any update on if the Supreme Court wants to, I'm being cynical again, accept some responsibility and make a decision? Or two, what happens if the Supreme Court comes down with a decision in the middle of this redistricting process that is favorable for small cities in terms of the Santa Monica position.
So as we all know, I have no crystal ball. But I think realistically the Supreme Court is very aware of the timing and is probably not going to give us a decision in time to avoid this process. The same process everyone else is going through. They continue that don't make a decision. Right they have the right to make a decision on their own timeline there are no There are no time limits for the State Supreme Court in the window we're in during the briefing process, but before they've held argument. The deadline for the Supreme Court like all courts in California is once they've heard argument and submitted the matter, they have 90 days to issue their decision. The court is very good at not hearing argument until they're ready for a decision.
So they theoretically can sit on it forever. I don't think that'll take forever I do think we're not going to get a ruling until after folks have completed this process, which i realize is extremely inefficient and disruptive but that's my best assessment of what the court's likely to do. If a ruling comes down well that's favorable that allows the city to credibly drop districts then we would obviously take that to council and take a look at it But I don't think we're gonna have that in the process. Our deadline to completely redistricting is April of next year, I don't think we're gonna have a ruling from the court in the next seven months that allows us to do so. Yeah,
I just wanted to repeat for everyone's knowledge to remind everyone, the finding of the appeals court was that the group supposedly benefiting by the law were not benefitting by the new law to summarize. And that's the issue that the Supreme Court doesn't seem to want to take up is, you know, that appeals court core finding. In other words there's a and correct me if I'm wrong Matthew but that was the key point that this was supposed to enhance underrepresented rights and it wasn't doing that in a small city environment
Right to summarize a 80-page decision, the Court of Appeal found that Santa Monica's switch to district based elections did not actually improve representation of the Latinx community and thereby did not need to be forced. They did not hold that the federal standard which requires the ability to create a majority minority district is this California standard Instead, they had a nebulous 20-page standard that sort of boiled down to is it beneficial to the group at issue or not.
And the Supreme Court has noted is taken up the case but hasn't yet issued its ruling and I don't expect to have a ruling anytime soon although like I said I don't have a crystal ball so we may see one tomorrow We're monitoring the case quite closely. If a ruling comes down that's in any way beneficial to the city, we will immediately have it on the next available meeting or a special meeting to evaluate how to deal with it as a council. In the meantime until and really if we get a very clear umbrella of protection, our recommendation is to stay the course and complete the redistricting process.
1:10 – 1:2655 turns
Thank you Matt. Thank you, Sophia. Much appreciated and we will see you again.
And before Sophia departs did we have anyone who wished to speak in the public? So far it's been...
I was going to ask yeah any other questions? We'll move to public comment.
We have no people signed up to speak on Zoom.
Great all right we'll close the public comment. If
you want to note something because i think i heard folks kind of mentioning when maps Under the Fair Maps Act, there will be two hearings that are just pre-maps so available to listen to the public. And then the third hearing is when we can discuss drafts maps. So the next city hearing will be another kind of opportunity to hear testimony and then on the third one, we can submit maps and have that discussion. So I just wanted to note that.
Well, thank you very much. Lovely to meet you and look forward to seeing you again.
Yes, thank you all have a good evening. Thank you very much. Thanks. All
right we will close the public hearing and we'll move on to commission reports. Any commission reports today James?
I did not have anybody signed up one commissioner's signed up to speak on one of the council or one of the agenda items but I didn't have anybody signed up for commissioner reports Thank
you, we'll move on to public communication please. Whenever you're ready Gail, thank you.
The first person we have is Charles Baker. Charles I'm going to... Whoops! I'm sorry, clicked the wrong button. Charles you should be able to speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and talk. Charles Baker are you there?
Looks like he just raised his hand.
Yeah let me
see. Typed in yes so Mr. Baker it sounds like you can hear us but we can see that you're muted on your end
Yeah if you can unmute yourself Mr. Baker and we can, you can go ahead and
speak. For one second it said audio connected and then it muted again so Can you hear us? It looks like you're connecting now.
Yeah looks like you're connected are you there? And now he's muted again. Mr. Baker, I'm going to come back to you and I'll go to our next speaker. The next person is Christine Golden. And Christine, you should be able to speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and talk.
All right. Can everybody hear me?
Yes we can.
Good evening council members and staff and I want to thank you for the opportunity to speak tonight about the donation of the two benches in a sculpture at Club Vista Park.
It's on the consent calendar.
Yeah,
we have to wait.
Yeah Christine it's on the consent calendar that item so can we wait till we get there?
Oh absolutely
okay
you
want to
wait then you'll come back to me.
We will get back to you thank you very much. Thank
you very much Betsy I appreciate it.
Any other general
comments? Yes um I'm trying to make my screen behave one moment I'm going to put myself on mute so I can ask James Hahn a technical question. One moment. OK, I apologize for that. The next person is Ron Solorzano. Ron, you should be able to speak. If you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and talk.
All right. Can everyone hear me?
Yes we can.
Alrighty thank you so much members of council my name is Ron Solorzano and I am the regional librarian for the Ojai Valley and i just wanted to share with you a few exciting events that are coming up at the library in the month of October So this year the Ventura County Library is proud to announce its fourth annual One County, One Book community reading program.
One County, One Book aims to unite the Ventura County community around a common narrative spreading interest in and facilitating discussions about the selected book. This year's one county one book selection is Your House Will Pay by Steph Cha. From the official description, Your House Will Pay is a powerful and taught novel about racial tensions in L.A., following two families—one Korean American, one African American—grappling with the effects of a decades-old crime.
One County, One Book 2021 is presented by the Ventura County Library with the generous support of the Ventura County Library Foundation. Other program partners include California Lutheran University, The Museum of Ventura County and the Ojai Valley Library Friends and Foundation. All members of the public are invited to join Steph Cha for a virtual author talk and Q&A, which will take place via Zoom.
Additional details about this talk including how to register will be posted on our website. In the meantime you can save the date for this event which will take place at 2pm on Saturday October 30th One County, one book programs also include an in-person and live streamed faculty panel discussion on October 6th which is organized by Cal Lutheran University.
And a virtual book discussion on October 20th facilitated by Ventura County Library staff. More information on these programs and links for registration can be found on our website at www.vencolibrary.org slash OCOB Finally, I just wanted to remind everybody that the Ojai Library is open to the public for our normal hours of operation which are Monday through Thursday 10am-8pm and Friday through Sunday 12pm-5pm.
You can visit our website for latest updates on library programs and events and follow us on Facebook and Twitter for information on virtual story times reading contests, take-home activity kits and more. And I just want to add real quickly that we do also have at the library and in fact all of our library locations information on this redistricting initiative ways for people to submit feedback some forms and some maps and things like that so members of the public who are interested can drop by the library for more on that. Thank you so much for your time and please contact me if you have any questions thank you
Thank you, Ron. And that book sounds great. Can't wait to read it. All right, any more public
comments, Gail? We have no one else who signed up to speak has actually logged in. But I'm going to try Mr. Baker again. Charles Baker if you're there, if you can, oh, you seem to be unmuted. If you can go ahead and speak anytime.
Can you hear me now?
Yes we can.
Finally, I must have had it could have been a technical issue on my side. I'm sorry. Okay so my wife and I are in district four, and we live over in the Ohio craftsman village which is kind of down by Bryant circle in the tennis academy and all that it's the newer live workspaces we've had our business here for almost two years in November. You know, here talking tonight is because the homeless situation right here on this little on the street which is you know pretty much the corner of Fulton and Pearl just down from it right here in the space between the craftsman village and the tennis Academy.
It has been for the last two years that we've been here, just I don't understand how it can be let to go on like it is. We've had to call the police multiple times and over the periods of times we've done it, the police have always said well you're gonna have to talk to the Ojai City because that's the only way to get them from not being able to stay back here in park and live like they do. And so now the police really don't even respond.
And just over the weekend, I walked outside at six o'clock in the morning and I've got these guys out there just puking their guts out hanging out of their vehicles. It's trashy over there you can't even don't want to walk down the street. We've witnessed abuse of their animals. There's one set of people that's lived here for the two years that we've lived here, and a lot of others just come and go. They seem to all kind of commute together and have their little parties. And I called the police and I said this guy is over here throwing up. He's very obnoxious maybe he needs help. Maybe you need to send someone to help this man. And they pulled up, the police wasn't there 30 seconds and left. And then people started laughing and then the police called me and said hey, there's no problem with them we can't do anything about it bye.
And within two minutes of the police leaving I go back outside and here's that same person now instead of hanging out of his car vomiting all over the street he's hanging on to a tree. I've got some of this on video. But those are the kind of things that we put up with back here. And I'm just curious as to why we can't get something like that taken care of, why it's allowed to exist in this part of Ojai?
I know there's homeless people all around town and I know they're all over California and other cities and other scenarios. But this is a community back here for these guys and Yeah, and I've got people. We even have people coming up to our water spigot taking a bath. It's just crazy. I just don't understand why it's allowed to be a commune back here. And it still goes back to the police telling me the same thing over and over. You have to talk to the Ohio City, you have to talk to Ojai City. They'll need to put maybe in no parking thing overnight because all they technically have to do is move their car six inches.
within like I don't remember what the police officer said if it was 48 or 72 hours, but I see I'm running out of time. And so that's my complaint in district four and I would just happy to bring that to your attention and I hope this something can be looked into and done about it thank you.
Thank you Mr. Baker James could we look into this?
Yeah Mr. Baker well somebody from my office will be contacting you in the next few days and we'll follow up with you.
I appreciate that thank you so much
A quick question. Yeah, go ahead. Mr. Summers I assume the restraints on dealing with homeless don't include the ability to enforce trespass on private property is that not the case?
Yes a trespass on private property remains a viable option Absolutely. The restrictions that are in place under a ruling by the Ninth Circuit relate to enforcement of anti-camping ordinances generally on public property, public streets rights of way but we're still allowed to enforce in particular times and places And we've provided information on that opportunity to the sheriff's department. So clearly we need to connect through the city manager's office with the sheriff's department and Mr. Baker, to understand where the disconnect is and how we can take a look at improving the situation.
And the restrictions on enforcing anti-camping rules it doesn't prevent us from enforcing basic rules of civil conduct?
Yes, the rest of the... The prohibition is essentially we can't arrest someone when all they're doing is sleeping or existing in the right-of-way. On that alone, the rest of the penal code remains So drinking in public, drugs in public, possession of unlawful substances, consumption of unlawful substances. Those remain viable options so to trespass of course if they come onto private property theft things like that the rest of the penal code remains in place.
And we've discussed this 72-hour thing before and what it means in terms of moving. And we've raised the issue of whether council needs to legislatively clarify what a move means, define the move in other words. James and
I had discussions with the sheriff's captain had explained that the city's position is that movement is at least a block. And so we'll circle back with the sheriffs if they need further clarification, we can certainly bring it to council to get that
clarified. We may have to do some legislative clarification okay thank you.
Randy? Just quickly mayor thank um thank you um it seems like uh you know having the Was it our district attorney? Who's the county attorney? The county
attorney.
It's interesting that he was talking about victims and issues of that concern, and then here we are talking about a homeless situation. And in the consent item in number H which I was going to pull, it's the Ventura County-wide hopelessness And it's interesting how all three of these are all playing out and playing together. Maybe that's the theme for the evening, but I think we should agendize this and have a deeper discussion because once again, I'm hearing law enforcement as the means to the ends, and I'm not sure if that's what the means are.
I'm not sure who we could send out there to maybe help These individuals and I'm sure it can't just be one, but we need to think it through into how we're going to interact with individuals that are homeless or in dire straits. And as much as I believe our police department could handle the situation and handle it well, I'm not sure if that's who our first responder should be so Maybe we need to agendize this and maybe we need to talk about who should our first responder be, and how should we connect and interact with these individuals and help them.
So I'll bring that up later in the evening on future agenda items. And again when we get to consent, I'm going to pull H so we can just briefly talk about it because it seems like where we are talking a little more in depth than what we should be in responding to this citizen's concerns.
1:26 – 1:3314 turns
Correct. Okay, thank you so let's move on that's it Gail for public comment? Correct. Okay so let's move on to the consent calendar is there a motion?
Yes I'm going to be pulling L the donation agreement from the consent calendar.
Okay anything else Randy you're pulling?
I'd like to pull H just for a brief discussion.
L and H okay all right is there a motion to approve everything else
So moved. Second.
Okay great, roll call please Neal.
Roll-call vote Passed 5–0 moved. Second. Okay great, roll call
Show transcript
Great
thank you all right so let's look at H first
So Mayor, I just had some questions regarding this. I read it thoroughly and it's interesting there is a lot of beneficial aid that's out there in the public arena I'm just not sure how many homeless people or people in dire straits are aware. And I was thinking about this repurposing of policing and how that discussion is ongoing, and how this might be exactly what the community was talking about in regards to how we interact with our citizens.
And so having said that, I see some benefits into us figuring out as a council how we can better help individuals of needs in this community. And in this section here on the Ventura County White Homelessness, I just think that it will go hand-in-hand with any type of future discussions with our police department for additional or modification of existing policing policies and how we can incorporate something like this into it.
So that again, we don't have a first responder who who as well as our police officers are trained, I'm just not sure that they need to be the first person interacting with a homeless person or a person of need in a lot of these situations. That's why I pulled it. Another question is, who interacts on the city behalf? Is it the help of Ojai that puts forth the policies that are in this section? Is that who we're depending on?
Would that be our first responder? I'm not sure if it is and The VCCOC coordinator, would it be beneficial that maybe again we agendize him and have them come in and do a presentation so that we better understand what the county's doing and how it interacts with our community? So I just thought it was an interesting read. It was valuable, and it was important for the times that we're in.
And again, I'll bring it up later on in the evening as far as agendizing it. So thank you.
There's no public comment on this, Gail? This item.
We have two people who have signed up for public comments on the consent calendar plus Christine Golden who signed up for public communications. I don't have any information on these speakers on which item on the consent calendar they want to speak on so I can bring them on if you'd like and they can say.
I'm fairly certain they're speaking on another item So I can quickly answer a couple of those questions just for some background information. The Continuum of Care is currently, they currently operate and they've been actually operating with all the cities during COVID to make sure to, this is where we partnered with the county and the other cities on projects like Project Room Key where rooms were provided to the homeless during COVID. So we've been partnering with them. It was actually kind of funny it was by all intents and purposes, the city has been working with them as if we were part of this MOU. And it wasn't until recently when we kind of Check the paperwork that we realized the city actually never officially signed on. So it's been operating that way, we just haven't dotted the I's and crossed the T's.
But to answer your question about who's like the contact person, who's the service provider locally? There's really two main ones within the city and that's gonna be the City of Ojai and Health of Ojia. And so during COVID when we've had different projects I spoke with the project room key and some of the food services. Those have all gone either through the city or through the health of Ojai, and so they are the main two providers.
The other potential provider is the Ojai Valley Family Shelter. Health of Ojai has signed on to this MOU and they are also participating in it. The family shelter has not signed on to the MOU yet The lead of the continuum of care. And she stated that she believes it's just because it's a lot of paperwork that hasn't been processed yet, similar to the situation we were in. So those would probably be between the city and the help of Ojai and the family shelter, those would be the three main agencies that would be part of this partnership in the Ojai Valley. And then also I just met with Tara Carruth, who is the lead on the continuum of care. And she did in fact offer to present if that would be something interesting to council. So if we do come back with some discussion of homelessness I will make sure to include her as well.
Susan? Yeah what I do know is that we have some homeless people. I can think of two off the top of my head who've lived in Ojai all their life But they're now being housed and they're grateful for having housing, I guess it's through the project room key or they're at a hotel in Oxnard. They don't have a car and they want to come back to Ojai so I do wanna support Randy putting this on the agenda And figuring out, if we at the very least can't have a legal campground or something so that people don't have to be in the neighborhoods.
We definitely need to take a deeper look at this and at the very least provide for people who've lived here all their life. You know, we can't provide for all the homeless but certainly Vietnam vets who are homeless who went to school at Nordoff certainly as a community we can provide something for those people
1:33 – 1:3813 turns
It's a great opportunity for us to say yes to the resources, the county resources. And I spoke with Matt Levere a couple months ago and he really wants to partner with us which is exciting. Randy?
So just to follow up James, I appreciate the comments but if I asked you just bluntly who would we send to solve that problem? Who would we send?
Right now we would send the Sheriff's Department. Pardon? We would send the police.
Thank you.
I just like, for example in Portland and Berkeley when you call the police for it you can ask for the de-escalation line specifically and it's worked really well apparently cahoots in Portland so that's definitely I agree with you Randy something we can look into because for most of the calls in Ojai that's what is needed. Okay great anything else? We can move on to Elle now. Is that you Bill?
Can I quickly ask, is that tabled for now or are we planning to?
Well let's pass it yeah. I would make a motion to approve item H. Second.
Okay a vote please on this Gail.
Roll-call vote Passed 4–0 motion to approve item H. Second. Okay a vote please on this Gail. · 1 under review
Show transcript
All right, we'll move on to L and we have some public comments on this.
Yeah let's go with that first. Then I'll state my issue.
Thanks Bill
Okay, I will bring Christine Golden back in. Christine you should be able to speak uh you're unmuted you can go ahead and talk
thanks Gail good evening council members and staff and i want to thank you for the opportunity to speak to you tonight about the donation of two benches and a sculpture at Cluff Vista Park I am appealing to you not as an arts commissioner, but on behalf of my brother, Tom Bostrom the parks designer and my four siblings. Bostrom and associates along with Van Atta and Associates won the Southern California chapter of the American Society of Landscape Architects top landscape design award in 2005 for Clough Vista Park.
The park, and these are Tom's own words was designed to reflect the nature of Ojai's rugged countryside and native plant communities. A place unique in the entire world from West End to East End the five microclimates are represented every boulder path artwork and feature is a carefully thought out it's part of a whole There are no areas of Clough Vista Park to co-opt and use for a completely different and discordant theme and purpose.
At the very least, adding elements diminishes the award given for the park's cohesive design." Now Kathy Clough could not be here tonight and she has given me permission to read her email so I'm going to do that now. And Kathy says, "'The park was designed with intent The idea of adding a memorial sculpture in this location is incongruent with the intention of what my parents worked so hard to create.
I'm all in favor of the Children's Memorial and honor that desire, just not in Clough Vista Park. The park was designed to be a children's teaching park. It's about butterflies, native plants, regrowth and nature in general. Please preserve not only my parents wishes, but the design integrity of our gateway park. And I want to add to that, that I agree with Kathy, the children's memorial garden deserves to be installed in an appropriate location. but Clough Vista is simply not that location. The suggested spot is an extension of the butterfly garden that lost its plants due to drought and replanting efforts were forming right before COVID shutdown, I was forming a group called Friends of Clough Vista Park to replant that area with the blessing of then public works director.
In closing, I have two requests. First that you deny the approval of the Ojai Children's Memorial Garden donation at Clough Vista Park and second that you pass a resolution in perpetuity that states no additions, no art, no benches, no alterations ever be allowed in Clough Vista Park. Thank you for listening. I appreciate all that each of you do for our city.
1:38 – 1:458 turns
Thank you, Christine.
Next we have Marcy Tosher and she is coming in via cell phone so hopefully this will work. Marcy, you should be able to speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and talk.
Oh, okay. I can hear you. Can you hear me?
Yes, go ahead.
Okay. Thank you for the opportunity to convey some thoughts about this donation of sculpture and benches to be placed in Clarke Vista Park. I'm not going to talk about the advisability substantive I want to talk about procedural issue from the perspective of the arts commission. The arts commission was created in 2003 for the purposes of advising city council at section 416.07 of the municipal code, the powers and duties is stated in the powers and duties of the art commission as the very first duty. And that is to advise the council on all matters pertaining to the arts in the community.
Um, so that's, that's kind of like the foundation for the art commission. And if anything needs input, um, regarding art sculpture and benches it's uh, the opinion of the arts mission, and we will give that opinion if this matter is brought before us to the city council, uh, the arts commission. That's quite a few works of public art in, in, uh... In the context of the public arts, uh, fund and public art program. Technically, uh, this isn't subject to the, um, that, um venue, but there are these, I want to give you examples of things that we consider when we're vetting a perspective piece of public art.
We look at the quality, the art form style, the environment that surrounds it, the permanence of it. The elements of design, the diversity of scale style, et cetera. Um, and uh, well those are, those are the main things, but um, I think they're important to realize that those are things that we would be considering if the, um, and when the sculpture work of art is brought to us what it is is basically this as a donation and there is a procedure established Uh, for the city of Ojai donations of art. Not only in a context of, uh, the public art program, but just outright donations, which is what is, what is, what this is?
So, um, we, yeah, the acquisitions committee determines the, um whether or not we will accept on behalf of the city or advise the city to accept a perspective piece of donated art So things like this are things such as artistic merit, aesthetic value materials and media scale liability safety and maintenance availability of suitable location and or placement and installation requirements. These are the things that we consider.
So I appeal to you to from our point of view the arts commission is not to Accept or reject this, but please just the next step. Actually the first step should have been brought to our attention for an examination and thorough vetting and decide this is still regardless of how it originated. This is still a piece of public art in the public view. And it needs to be at the level of all of our other works of art that are displayed in the city So I just think that's a bad precedent to let anyone put a piece of art somewhere without any kind of vetting or determination of suitability and all of that. Any artist could decide, oh, I want to, you know, Ojai is a brand now. I want to donate a piece
of art. All right. Thank you. Thank you so much, Marcy. And we have one more Gail?
That is it. We have one more person signed up, but I do not see her as having logged into the queue. Okay thank you.
Bill? Yeah i just wanted to make a procedural point here and that is that one of the really distinctive aspects of governance in our city is the role that the commissions play and we I think we make better decisions when we involve the commissions in these decisions. There's really two commissions involved in this matter, Park and Recreation Commission it is a park and the Arts Commission both of which have in our code that the very first power and duty is to act in an advisory council advisory capacity to this council.
So I just think we're going to make a better decision here if we engage the commissions as per our usual practice. And the discussion that we just heard really should be at a commission level and other suggestions may come up or not, I don't know. I'm not gonna...I don't want to speak to the merits of the particular proposal but I do think it is the kind of thing that should allow our commissions to engage in their a primary duty of advisory capacity. So that's going to be my suggestion that we get commission input on this matter, both commissions.
1:45 – 1:5327 turns
Well, I think all the comments that were made are sound and the opinions make sense. However, I believe what the city manager is my perception was trying to do was trying to mitigate an issue here at City Hall and had come to the conclusion that through interacting with that group that that was a good site Ultimately, whether it goes to the arts or goes to the parks or goes to historic preservation or goes anywhere. It still comes back to us five so My suggestion tonight would be to have the city manager Reconnect with this group and maybe we find an appropriate place such as the cemetery And maybe we dedicate the north wall and offer them a space for a really nice memorial for children.
I think in the past, we've talked about using the north end of the cemetery for different things. We've never done anything but It's quiet, it's serene. You go there to remember. There's a lot of good things about it and I think if we did it the appropriate way that it might fit the needs of this group. So I would suggest that maybe before we send it back to the commissions, that we give the city manager another shot at this.
And we just try to resolve it and try to move it forward. That would be my take on this.
Susan? Well, as I see it we have two separate items. One is the sculptor and two is the location. And what I suggest is that we have the park and Recreation Commission, I see four or five possible locations. I would like them to come back to us with the pros and cons as far as the cemetery goes there is already an area that's dedicated to children. And I agree with Randy, the cemetery, I hadn't thought of that till I heard this might be an appropriate place. But I would also like to know the pros and cons of Libbey Park, of Vista Park.
And also I wanna make clear we're also being asked to name the area behind City Hall right As it's still going to be called a Children's Memorial Garden. And the reason the sculpture can't be there is due to the noise factor, am I correct? Is that the reason so, I mean why are we separating the garden And the sculptor in the first place. So my understanding that's due to the noise factor, but there are still going to be an area known as the Children's Memorial Garden. Is that correct?
Yes. So the area where the two benches have been placed by the Children's Memorial Garden, that's just here behind City Hall. If the city council approved it, that would still be called the Children's Memorial Garden They did express that they wanted the statue located at another location. I'm not sure exactly the reason, but at different times they have indicated that they want a quieter location. Yes.
Well
why don't I...I'm sorry Randy. No go ahead. We're weighing in. I'll wait my turn. I''m good.
Well it seems to me that maybe we have a consensus to continue this item for further Issues and discussion for the city manager. We give discretion to the city manager, but continue maybe a motion to continue with no action pending of city managers further investigation and discussion.
That'd be, yeah. And I would agree with Susan and Bill, you know let's ask the parks since it's going to be in a park, let's ask the Parks and Rec Department to weigh in which
is-
Yeah
if that becomes the proposal, yeah.
In terms of the cemetery Randy, I've talked to the group specifically and I got the message that they would like it to be in a place that's visible for the community, you know, in town So that's why we have a variety of parks. Libbey Park might be an option or maybe once HELP moves, we have that whole area of the campus that's open so...
Yeah, let's consider what happens when help moves. Can that be part of the city manager? One reason I thought of Libby is because it's connected to the demonstration garden where the, you know, to the area where the Children's Memorial Garden is located So, but I would if help of if the location were behind the health of Ohio is a possibility. I would like to that to be included in
I'm not taking any options off the table. I'm just saying my motions continue with no action to allow the city manager or investigation input. Okay,
Randy?
So once again, this goes back to I think Christina making a request that we never modify or change or do anything to Clough Vista Park. In the reality of public facilities they're all at one point or another going to be changed So I would never accept that as something that I would agree to. You can question public art and you can question where's the appropriate place for it, but when you question parks and you look at the fact that they're constantly changing and evolving and just look at this discussion. We're looking at five other parks, we're looking at another area of Libby.
I mean again i would i'm just going to end it for me and say let's give this back to the city manager let him work with that group and let them figure out something that's appropriate and that hopefully it fits into the character of the community um and the needs of the community. So are you seconding my motion? Yes, I am Bill. All right.
I thought your motion was beyond just sending it back to the group and the city manager. I thought your motion was to involve the two commissions?
My motion is to continue the item with no action for the city manager to do further investigation and discussion
but so
all of us would weigh in in terms of working with the city manager on our opinions
Okay, so it's not just the city manager consulting with the Children's Memorial Group.
It's beyond- No we would be talking to the city manager with our opinions is my take on that. Okay
thank you, great. All right we have a motion and a second. We have the roll call please Gail?
Roll-call vote Passed 5–0 motion and a second. We have the roll call
Show transcript
Okay, great um all right it's nine oh let's uh take our seventh inning stretch and we'll be back In a few minutes.
Sorry to lay that on you, James, but I just have so much respect for you. I just thought you were the best one
to
handle it. Thank you. OK. Oh, we're adjourned for a few minutes. Seven and?
Yep, yep. Couldn't you tell the public that we've reorganized the ending of the next items because people might be still thinking that item six is last
Okay, so when we come back I will say the order again. Okay okay all right thanks see you.
1:54 – 1:595 turns
We can adopt the resolution saying whatever, and then next week we can. Yeah, that's just crazy. I don't know who she thinks she is. Well, you know what? There's a way. My strategy here is I have this, like, there's an option. There's that option that works. I don't know about the other one. The only thing I'm looking at, I think they can do it as they say. And we'll meet and talk it over.
They can kind of go further if they want
to. Okay, and then we change that. Yeah, well I have something differently. And then how are you going to have a bunch of people praying over dead people who still can't?
Get some more water.
Thank you. So I didn't want to put James or you on the spot.
Okay.
1:59 – 2:046 turns
Betsy, I'm back. Betsy, I'm back.
Oh thanks Gail. Are we waiting to come back? Waiting for James. There he is. Hi James! Okay uh we're back Very much. We'll start with number three, item number three and just to review we moved item number four to the end since it's the longest so you'll go three five six and then four. So number three Ohio Certified Farmers Market License Agreement to approve and authorize a city manager to enter into license agreement with the market for one year in two additional mutual one-year extensions.
James will take it away
thank you Yeah, thank you. I will keep this one very short but happy to answer any questions in short the city in the past has issued what we call non-proprietary encroachment permits which are administrative permits signed off by the public works director and those permits have been issued to the farmers market for five year terms One of the things that we have talked to the farmers market about and one of the things we've realized is, one of the hot topics that comes up very often is people typically like to talk about the farmer's market and you know talk about You know, just this morning. In fact I had somebody call me that didn't know this was on the agenda and they asked if the city could work with the farmers market group to do something a little different on the weekends or we get requests to look at things like the hours or what booths there are and all those types of things.
And so really the point of this agreement is that It's a big topic here in Ojai. We think that it should be subject to a public review process where once a year, we come back to city council and maybe a consent item in the future if there aren't any ideas but it would come back to city council which would give the council and Discuss it, bring up any potential ideas or any questions about how the market's operating. And so we are recommending that we move over to this license agreement which would then have the reviews with the City Council.
For all intents and purposes none of the conditions are being proposed to change at this time. The hours and the location remain the same We have been talking to the farmer's market about the potential of looking at those in the future, but at this point we're not recommending any change. But we just, we were just recommending we go to the license agreement so that there is a public opportunity to discuss it in the future. So with that, the agreement as you mentioned is a one year term and has additional mutual options that may be exercised And but it otherwise keeps most of the conditions in place regarding hours, location dates etc. So we are recommending that the City Council approve it and with that I'll turn it back over to the City Council.
Thank you James any questions Susan and Randy?
James, on number six where it says vendors shall be limited to only those selling produce or food products or items related to agriculture and food products. That also includes things like beeswax candles, local soap, maybe some special things at Christmas. There's no restriction on that. I mean everything is at some point related to the earth
Yeah, and actually you know that's actually been a term that we the City Council in the past it actually I think it was in 2013. The City Council actually specifically stated that the council was okay with non-food items and so that language is from the existing permit but it's been expanded pretty broadly and we wouldn't expect to put a limitation on
2:04 – 2:1011 turns
Randy?
So James, just on that same venue. What does the county... what jurisdiction does the county have over this regarding food and food services and selling of either the products as Sousa talked about or other types of products other than food and let's say baked food?
Yeah so the county I think Can I remember if it's environmental health or public health? I think it's environmental health. But the county environmental health does have some oversight that they review, but also the main thing with the farmers market is that it's a certified farmers market and so they actually get their certification and are subject to review through that process as well.
Well, I just didn't see it noticed anywhere in here that there was another jurisdiction or another body had some governing factors over them. So I'd like to see that included the other thing is you know, like we like just what happened with COVID last year. If there's an emergency declaration, I didn't see anything in here regarding that. There's a 30-day notice but I didn't see anything in any form of emergency and our powers and their ability to deal with it so I think something like that should be included. And then the other thing on your insurance is I didn't see again anything that stated that they had to submit to you a list of employees So that we knew exactly who was being, you know, who we would interact or who we involve ourselves with.
Or how we even know who the employee of the week is there on Sunday. So I think that's important that we clarify that and instead of two trash cans this is probably the smallest I like to see six. Two at the back, two at the front and two in the middle Can we think of upgrading the two to six? And then I'll, I have a couple more questions when we get to deliberation.
I could answer just one of those questions. The other ones, the last two questions, we can follow up and see if we can add those. The one comment or the question about, does this address potential emergency situations? That was in our mind when we drafted it. So what we did was under specific terms like the dates and times of the farmers market at the location We have language that states that if the city needs to change the date or the time of the location, including because of an emergency, that we have the ability to do that. And so to your point, the one challenge with that is because they're certified, they would have to then work with other agencies to do that but the agreement would give us the ability to do that if we needed to.
Quick question, how long has the fee been $50? It's been that since I believe it was 2013 it was set at that amount.
Okay thank you. And Mayor? Yes Randy? You know under miscellaneous could you clarify 21-1 this agreement may create a possessory maybe this is for Matt possesses here help me with that word possessory interest which is subject to property taxation An organization may be subject to such taxes. Is that a liability they have, a liability we have or it's just in there for GP?
Yeah I don't think that it's likely to actually happen but it is there to protect the city if an interest is created where there is a tax then the farmers market has to pay it but I don't see that actually happening and I doubt it's happened In the 10 years it's been at that location.
And I would add that by switching away from a conditional use permit into a facility use agreement, the intention is to not create possessory interest meaning not create a property right for the farmers market instead it's a license agreement but if the county assessor controller who assesses property taxes disagrees with us then the farmers markets responsible for those taxes
And then Mayor, just two more questions. James do we require them to designate an employee to be on site every Sunday or every day that they're open?
So you know we can clarify that in the agreement The idea as it's drafted is that the manager, Cynthia would be that person and she's the person that we would contact and the person that would be on site. But it's not clear to your point so we can clarify that and add that clearly to the agreement.
Right, I'm aware in the past that we hadn't had a contact person on site and that we had to call Cynthia. And a lot of times I think she lives, well it says she lives here in Ojai but I thought at one time she lived in Santa Barbara and wasn't always available so I could be wrong on that. I'm just stating that. And then my last question is did we Did we go to the other businesses in the area and ask them what the impacts of the farmer market is on them regarding parking on Sunday? If there's none, if there's some, what are they?
Did we do a survey with those individuals or those companies or property owners?
2:10 – 2:1624 turns
We had a meeting with the farmers market and the Chamber of Commerce where we wanted to get some feedback from the local businesses. And if there was feedback about little tweaks that could be made that would help the businesses, then we can do that. The Chamber of Commerce Executive Jamie Fleming was at that meeting. He then met with some businesses and he reported back that at this point, he wasn't hearing a lot of requests or a lot of asks from the local businesses. I know he had listed some of the businesses he talked to but so that's why ultimately we ended up not suggesting any modifications or changes but again Keeping the discretion and the ability to do so if we do start hearing from those members of the public. I'm sorry, those business owners.
Thank you.
Thank you. Susan, question? No suggestion, I'll wait. Public comment on this Gail?
We have one person here Ashley Corman, I will bring her in. Ashley, you should be able to speak now. If you're unmuted, you can go ahead.
I'm just Cynthia's daughter and I'm still involved from afar so I'm just listening in no comments. Okay
thank you and also council if you have any questions for Cynthia Corman she's made herself available this evening as well.
Thank you all right let's move on to discussion. Suza?
James You know, my recollection is at one point we were looking at if it was possible to close that section of the street off the traffic Sunday morning. And at that point it didn't seem possible right? Because of the Lavender Inn and Rainbow Bridge claimed that they had deliveries but I was wondering if we could at least on Sunday morning reduce the speed limit to 15 miles per hour You know, between the hours of 7 a.m and 1 p.m?
That's something I if council is that if there's consensus on that, it's something I can meet with the police chief in the public works director and see how we could do that. It's not something we've looked at. We had looked into potentially closing the street. We have not looked at that before so we can look at that and report back
The reason I say that, it's just on my mind. Maybe Council Member Wyrick remembers when we were campaigning, we did see some people speeding inpatient and it's just a good reminder. I mean, I don't want anybody really... Most people would go slow anyway because it's so heavily, you know there are so many pedestrians walking back and forth.
You need to creep through there with anything motorized or bicycles even they go in there too fast sometimes.
Yeah
okay we could look
into yeah some temporary options for that. So
yeah anything to make it more pedestrian friendly that we can do I
think
is always good
Bill? Just a small point following up on my question. $50 in 2013 is already equivalent to just under $60 today from the beginning of 2013 this far into 2021. And you know, the fee should cover the cost of at least have some relationship to covering the cost of the administrative costs of handling this thing. You put a lot of time into it. There's reporting I have to check on insurance and stuff. I wonder if we oughta just set it to 100 bucks instead of 50 see if there's any appetite in the rest of council for that.
Can we think about that for a moment?
Randy raises hand.
So I knew Bill was going to go there so right now they're paying roughly $2,400 a year if they were open every Sunday roughly four times a month. I'm kind of in agreement. Part of what I look at is the impact on the other businesses. The downtown is shut down to a degree on Sundays for the farmer market, and that's what I look at. We like to say that a lot of the people that visit the farmer market visit the other businesses but I'm not sure if that's true because we haven't studied it so we don't really know.
So I'd be inclined to increase the fee. I'm open to any suggestion, you know if it's 100 it's 100 if it's more it's more
just try to cover the cost of administration
well
And one final thought, Mayor. If we're going to police Matilija, we need to police Aliso because there's just as many issues on it as there are in Matilija. So I'm not sure how we can dedicate policing just to those two streets every Sunday. I would leave that up to the City Manager and the Chief to figure out but There's more than just one concern on Matilija and then the other The other factor is now with the increased bicycling, especially electric bicycles Their speeds are greater than 15 greater than 10 sometimes 20 sometimes 30 I've heard some can go to 40 so Again you got to take a look at all of this in the content of what we're trying to achieve there in that in both of those corridors not in one and
2:17 – 2:2316 turns
Susan? Well, I don't want to involve the police with this. So I would suggest just signage at both entrances reminding people to be courteous, slow down. There has to be some way. I don't like the idea of if we post a different I don't know. But going so it was just a suggestion and if it's feasible or not, I just would hope people most people are not out there to you know running over people so far but by as far as increasing the price my question to James is are we Are they paying enough to cover costs or is this justified? The city should not be making money, a profit off of these fees. It should be strictly to cover the cost of staff, correct?
And the wear and tear of the facility.
Yeah, I would say it's hard to say what an average year is especially this year with COVID and everything. I would say this year for sure Different points when we had our code enforcement out enforcing social distancing and, you know, crowd limits and things like that. I would say this year for sure we spent more on the farmers market than we received In a normal year where it's more standard, you know, maybe that is not true. But I would say for sure this year and I think it has been, I think it was 2013 when the City Council and to clarify, I think the city council in 2013 actually had an item To discuss whether to increase the fee from $50 so I think that fees actually been in place even longer than that.
And so we're even less
than real terms now
yeah yeah, so it you know that is something probably worth looking at and so the. Obviously it's a two. It's a contract, it's an agreement. It's between two parties so it obviously have to be negotiated with the farmers market. So that's something that we can go back and work with them on if that's identified as an issue.
Yeah I would be okay to do it if you can negotiate and get their feedback, whether it's a hardship or not. I see the farmers market as a wonderful community service. Nobody there is getting rich off of farmers market. If they are, it's the exception, not the rule. It's more important than ever during this period Where we're in possibly for a long pandemic that people have access to healthy food, it's extremely important. So all of that has to be considered but you can bring it up I'd be fine with it.
One idea to move forward would be if we can, we'll take the feedback but we can meet with the farmers market at the next week or so And put, negotiate something that works for both the farmers market at the city and then bring it back on consent on the 28th.
Just one, just a final thought because we don't have a condition of the contract to review their books. In other words, we're not getting a percentage of their gross. I don't think we're ever going to know how much money they make or if they do make money and personally i don't even think that that's any of our business. I don't really care if they make money or not make money. They show up so obviously they're doing something The second thing is maybe we need to have public works actually assess the parking lot, because of what I said previous.
The money should be the money that we're procuring I agree Sousa should not be to put any burden on any of the individuals selling product there. But we should recover the cost of repairing the parking lot, striping, asphalting. The conditions of the sidewalks front and back, the conditions of the approaches. I mean there's a the conditions of the trees. There's a lot of things that are going to deteriorate due to the use now, whether we're parking cars there or whether we're selling agriculture products one day a week on Sunday. I'm just saying that there's a balance there that has to be created and no one's ever brought us any numbers based on that parking lot so I don't even know if there's any correlation or if we should have one.
And the administrative costs as well. So I think it's just worth pointing out that the $50 is pretty incidental. $100 is pretty incidental, and if it's been more than 2013 that hadn't been changed, in real terms we're probably close to 100 from where it was first 50. Well
are we ready for a motion? Yes? Well, I'd like to make a motion to approve and authorize the city manager to enter into a license agreement with the market for one year and two additional mutual one-year extensions.
Would you take a friendly amendment to raise the fee to $100 in that motion? Yep. Okay
then I'll second it. And can we add additional trash cans to that facility?
Are they needed? Do they need them?
Well can we say if needed? Needed. Can we investigate that?
Yes, we can investigate that.
Okay may have the roll call please.
2:23 – 2:3617 turns
I thought we were just going to let James go talk to them first and see if it was a hardship and negotiate with them or are we just moving right to because it's gonna feel a lot different to them. If we tell him, we've all voted at $100 on their new contract ticket reliever versus what I thought we were talking about a minute ago that James is going to talk to them first but maybe I didn't understand
Okay so can we agree to take that off and have James negotiate that? Bill are you okay with that?
Could someone please repeat it, I didn't hear it.
The contract would come back at a future meeting probably hopefully on consent if we're able to work something out
yeah all I'm saying is we're not approving a contract then yep
right what James said before right now did I hear correctly James that's what I thought you were going to do don't let James go talk make sure it's not something Anywhere that's a different number, they'll bring it back and we'll talk about it again. If not, if everybody is in agreement on their end then we'll have it on the consent calendar. But I mean, even talked to them, I don't want them to feel like it's a take or leave at $100 cuz I have no idea. That's not a ton. I was mapping it out as maybe a couple of bucks per vendor for a week. It's not a ton but still these are papers in margin just so they're operating under.
I know they've said before that it was not a real lucrative business. The principle of the thing is that we cover our costs for providing it.
If we take a small loss on like a farmer's market, that's a really great thing for Ojai. I hope we can
recover all of
it
but... Oh, I'm saying if it was 50 bucks 10 years ago, that's not 50 bucks now. No you said it's about 60. No, I understand so in real terms, we should stay constant in real terms.
Randy? So, because I could barely hear Ryan for some reason. What I'm hearing is this will come back to us with the modifications that the mayor and William and I have addressed. Is that what I heard? Yes. And I think the last thing I'd like to say before we vote is, the public good that the farmers market does, we can't lose sight of that. That's why actually having some numbers as to what it costs to maintain it and whatever your administrative fees would be James, I think are important for us to know and that might help us to figure out how to increase it appropriately if we choose to.
Yes, I agree. What a great benefit to our community and Sunday ritual for a lot of us so well we have a motion in a second so you have a roll call please Gail?
I guess it's modified to send back to the city manager with no approval of the contract okay all right
Roll-call vote Passed 5–0 motion in a second so you have a roll call please Gail? I guess it's modified to send back to the city manager with no approval of the contr
Show transcript
Wonderful, all right
we'll move on to the next it's item number five that COVID report from James thank you James.
Thank you mayor I have a quick presentation but i will be sharing my screen for for a second okay are you able to see the screen Okay, so we have a COVID update for today. We wanted to start by going over the trends I think we talked last council meeting that we weren't in the midst of a surge it wasn't quite back at the levels that we saw in late December early January But we were seeing a surge and the face covering order had just been put into place countywide. So with that, we wanted to give just a brief update on how things have proceeded over the last few weeks since that time.
Some may have seen that there was a big increase in the average case rate in the cases reported yesterday I believe it was. And the county has reported that that was actually due to a data backlog. So it's not as concerning as it may have initially seemed, some of the numbers seem to jump a bit where I think the seven day average case rate went from about 16 to almost 22 but again, that was due to a data backlog and so this chart is helpful to put it in context of looking at the last year or so And seeing where we are now, which is obviously this right-hand side where we are seeing a bump here.
But compared to where we were in December and January, where the increase was much more severe. But part of the reason why the county put the face covering order in and why some of these restrictions have been put back into place Because of the need to stop that from spiking and kind of trying to keep it flat, which has happened pretty well over the last couple of weeks since that's happened.
This chart in particular is actually for the 93023 zip code, which is 20,000 people. And so this is actually very specific data for us and it shows that like the rest of the county and the state we did see a surge here over the last month or so but it's stabilizing is the feeling. More than case numbers, the two important statistics in our conversations with public health and the county are the hospitalization rate and the ICU rate.
You know if you think of that logically if people are testing positive but they aren't showing symptoms they aren't getting hospitalized they arent ending up in the ICU then It's not quite the drain on the resources, which is really the challenge if people are being hospitalized in the ICU and we don't have capacity or beds for those people. So a positive thing we're seeing is that those numbers have come down actually pretty... The hospitalization rate has come down pretty significantly from just three weeks ago from when we were back up to about 147 and now we're back down three weeks later to 103 That those numbers are the highest they've been since about mid February, but they're trending the right direction as we speak. And I think in particular yesterday there was a big drop of about 30 cases or 30 people that had been hospitalized who were no longer hospitalized and so those numbers are coming down and those are two of the key metrics that the county is looking at and What to do next and what orders to put in place or keep in place.
And we'll get to that in a minute when we talk about the face covering update, but one other piece of data we wanted to show is now that a large percentage Is fully vaccinated. The county is putting out more complete data for cases related to the fully vaccinated population, and so this is the latest update related to that of our almost a million population for the county we have about five just over 500,000 who have been fully vaccinated Amongst those 500,000 we've only had 2,449 cases which is an infection rate of about half a percent.
So very different story from the case rates that we're seeing amongst the non-vaccinated at this point. We know that 240 of those cases, about 10% of them have occurred in the last 14 days which is part of that surge we were talking about. And then as far as two key metrics which is the number of deaths among those fully vaccinated from COVID-19 and the hospitalizations from those fully vaccinated, we have 21 deaths of those 2,449 cases and 129 of the 2,449 cases have resulted in hospitalizations. So again it just speaks to what we're seeing with the fully vaccinated is that even if you get sick a much lower rate of people going to the hospital which again helps the overall picture because it means that there's beds and capacity for those that really need it.
So just to kind of paint the picture I think at this point especially as far as we're into this Sometimes it feels like nothing's changed or sometimes it feels like things are almost going back to normal. I think the reality is in the middle where we are still in the midst of a surge, but we have better results and better outcomes than we did a year ago or even six months ago.
With that, locally testing has been added on Mondays. So we now have COVID-19 testing at Sarzotti Park on Mondays, Wednesdays and Fridays from 9am to 3pm. We also worked with COVID Clinic to get some increased staffing at the site. We're hearing positive on that. I think we all were aware about a month ago we were hearing about long lines at the site. We've been hearing that that has been diminished now We are seeing a lot of people come in for testing. I think about a month ago, we had about 110 tests over two days.
This most recent week, we had 260 tests over three days. So it seems like adding that day was good timing because I think we would have had higher capacity showing up on the two days if we hadn't done that. So that's going to remain available at this time for And we do recommend if you're planning to go to Serzatti Park, get pre-registered. Go online at covidclinic.org. It makes the process much smoother and quicker.
And then the latest update regarding the face covering policies is that when the county had put the order in effect on August 20th they had announced that it would be in effect until September 19th. which is Sunday. And so just this morning, Ventura County Public Health announced that the order will very likely be extended past September 19th. So they have not officially extended it but they're indicating that and we're expecting that they will extend it past this weekend.
We don't have a date to report yet but we'll be posting updates on that And anybody interested can check our website or our Facebook page in the next couple of days. And we should have information on that soon, but it looks like that order is going to be extended at this point. And then lastly, we just wanted to note that locally We are getting calls with a lot of questions about if certain businesses have to have face coverings, if outdoor dining needs to have face coverings.
And so just as a reminder the order does require our face coverings indoors in public settings but not outdoors. We've been having our code enforcement officers go out to local businesses with copies of our flyers and the county's fliers And we've been doing a lot of education and outreach. And I think a lot of the calls right now are kind of based on that distinction of whether somebody serving food outside needs to wear a face covering. And so, we've gone out, we've talked to businesses about that, made sure they're aware of the requirements. We'll keep kind of doing that, doing the outreach and putting some of these reminders around town.
So with that, that is the latest update on COVID. And we're happy to answer any questions.
2:36 – 2:413 turns
No questions? Any public comment on this item, Gail? No public comment. Well I would just like to say thank you, thank you, thank you James for It's a whole part of your job you never knew existed, right? So you've done such an incredible job and being taken the bull by the horns and being ahead of the game. Ojai is so lucky to have you. Thank you. Discussion items or I guess we can move on. All right, thank you.
Thanks James. Well
let's move on to item number six, a request from Council Member Blatz and Council Member Haney to review city protocols particularly the process of placing items on the agenda. And just historically we're returning to this item which was on which Council Member Blatz and Council Member Haney put on the agenda um on the 12th of January my first meeting Thank you for coming back.
Oh yeah, could you Yeah.
So actually that you brought up January. We might have brought it up even before that too when Mayor Johnson was around. The purpose and the intent of protocols, I'm just going to make clear some parts of this little manual that we have. OK? It's the rules of decorum. It's how we conduct meetings. Correct? That's what we do is let us five choose. So I think it's important that we understand that. It our board meeting.
It's our opportunity to meet and discuss and interact, and do the people's business. The second thing that it does that I think is most important is we take action by council. We discuss things. We listen to the recommendations made by city staff. We listened to other council members as things are presented Public comments are allowed. So when we look at the whole body of this, of protocols, it has everything to do with how we conduct ourselves in this room and the reason I brought it back and I'll be honest with you is because of what took place at the last council meeting.
The fact that we had an agendized item And it was the second time that someone had decided that they weren't prepared and pulled it. And I have other issues with that, that I'm going to bring up along with these protocols. But that's what kind of set it in motion is I just felt that if we're here to do the people's business and we have a limited amount of time to do it then we need to set an agenda. We need to know what that agenda is. We need to prepare ourselves for that agenda. And then we need to come in here opened willing to listen and to participate in that.
And I haven't seen that recently, and it's tiring. And that's the reason that I brought this back. So I would like to see the council go to a set-the-agenda, like tonight for instance, set the agenda for the next meeting based on the information that the city manager has, the information that the mayor has You present it tonight, we agendize it and we move it forward.
And that way we know what we're going to prepare for the next two weeks. This all of a sudden thinking we're prepared and then having someone throw something in there in the middle of it or two things or three things is just not any way to conduct business. And that's the part that concerns me, is a lot of the stuff that I see being thrown on the agenda in the middle of the week actually has nothing to do with anything that we've discussed prior previously or has been brought to my attention. Now I'm only one of five so I'm not going to hear everything out there But I'm just saying there's a better way to do this than I think that we can do it by simplifying it, by setting the agenda and being prepared as council members to act on that agenda.
I'll have a couple more comments after Ryan if you'd like to speak and also after you open it up to the public.
2:41 – 2:4717 turns
All right. The number one comment I get from most people I talk to about our city council is that we talk a lot of, we talk about a lot of stupid stuff. We don't get a lot done and we waste a lot of time. So I just thought that this seemed like one rational way to support trying to help maybe change that the public comments that I read about that had a tone even kind of the way you introduced this mayor sticks That there was some conspiracy about mayor power, and this is a departure from history.
It has nothing to do with any reason why I seconded this and thought it might be a good idea to talk about it again. And I had nothing to do with putting it on the agenda in January either. I was on the council but I didn't put it on it. I just thought it was a reasonable way to maybe help figure out a way that we, it seems like we end up debating a lot of things that get us nowhere. And we don't end up passing and we review them a lot and we go backwards a lot.
I wish I had a better answer. I just thought this might be an answer but by no means is this some mean by making it having to be three people in general out of the five of us, it makes it harder for everybody. I mean, in no way is it supposed to decentralize the power of the mayor's ability to be able to put something on the agenda. But I understand that that's how some people took it. I just think it was one option that I hadn't really thought of and maybe we talk about about how to clean up and make things a little more efficient and just get to things that seem a little more important and we're not taking two steps forward one step back all the time.
That's all.
Any questions? Well, who put it on the agenda in January? Randy. You had to have two council members.
I didn't look it up. You brought it up. I'll say I
have no
idea. I
seriously personally have no idea.
James do you remember because I watched the meeting December and I'm pretty sure that Randy brought it up and you agreed Ryan. It's December 15th.
I honestly have no recollection. Mayor if you want to ask me why I brought it up, it was for the same reasons that I brought it up this time.
That's my point, I'm asking who put on the agenda at that meeting and I watched the meeting and it was both of you just to confirm
that.
Any other questions? Could we move on to public comment please?
OK. We have 11 people signed up to speak, and 10 are in the queue. I can go ahead and bring them in if you'd like to keep them at three minutes. That's up to you. That
would be great. Since it's been on the agenda twice, I think it's important to listen to everybody.
So
thank you.
The first person is Bill Miley, and I will bring him in. Mr. Miley, you can speak if you're muted. Please unmute yourself, and then we'll go ahead.
I am unmuted. Go ahead. Hello, for the record my name is Bill Miley. In general i think the council meetings go fairly well. I've reviewed the adopted protocols but getting to the point at issue today I have a couple of comments one is on agenda formation. I suggest consideration be given to adding the position of Mayor Pro Tem However, my preference is to add the mayor pro tem as a consultative not decisionary.
So that because of the leadership that person carries in reserve they'll know what's going on and they can also try to influence it. The second is the issue of requests by two members of the council to play something on the agenda which I assume is usually without staff involvement And here are a couple of my comments. Recent items seem to have been in early draft stages and were, from my opinion, challenging to understand and to consider application to the city.
So I have a couple of thoughts on how to manage that such items When being proposed by two council members should be presented to the entire council in an abstract format, which is short containing purpose method basis for with references problems being addressed and what's a likely sequence for adopting. The purpose of this meeting is not to present a plan or ordinance, but not to be presented in detail as if it's ready to be adopted as a program, a plan, or an ordinance.
The purpose is to be flexible and allow the council to address through thought out subjects, problems defined, solutions, innovative ideas that are Items proposed by two council members should get a quick review on its merits, how to make the city better and then a vote to bring it back if needed after the city manager and staff works with it. Thank you.
2:47 – 2:5510 turns
Next, we have Catherine Ferguson. Ms. Ferguson you should be able to speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead.
Hi there can you hear me?
Yes.
Hi thanks for taking my call tonight so I definitely took this item on the agenda to be in the idea that It would remove our mayor's ability to put items on the agenda. That's how I interpreted this and I just, I wanted to say that it does feel like it's been a longstanding tradition and in my mind would not be the correct thing to do in order to remove the mayor's ability. It's why we voted for our mayor I will say that it seems that 63% of the people who voted did vote for Betsy, and to represent them when as a community she has our voice. So when it comes to people's business, as we call it, I would say that we've asked her to be able to do that for us.
And forgive me, I'm not used to speaking. In the past when we do look back to Mayor Johnston who was elected twice by voters, I don't feel that this was ever an issue that was put on the agenda to remove his ability So I'm just, I wanted to say my part. I feel like we the people did elect the mayor to represent us, to do the people's business as you might say and to remove that it goes against what we've asked for so there you have it thank you.
Thank you Catherine
Next we have Corinna Wright. Ms. Wright, you should be able to speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead
Hi, thank you so much. I agree with Catherine it looks like this item is a move to strip Mayor Betsy's ability to place items on the agenda which really strikes me in the core because she was elected by myself and the majority of this community to put forth her agenda to really imagine the vision that we have for this community and for our city. And I think that this idea that Randy has put forth, We have to set the agenda after each meeting makes absolutely no sense.
Otherwise, we would be on a merry-go-round of items on the agenda. Things come up, things have to be prioritized. The city manager works hard on that and I appreciate that. And the mayor, the duly elected mayor has to maintain their role of being able to prioritize and move the agenda of the citizens of this town. And without her ability to place items on the agenda I don't see how she can represent our ideas and You know, I think that this resolution that they are putting forth just sort of smacks of bipartisanship and suggests that the council itself is exploiting the protocol in some way.
And I think they should really look at that. And I don't think a decision like this should be made so simply Something like this might have to require a special election, you know, to change our city bylaws or protocols. I certainly wouldn't want it to just be a simple majority of the City Council. Thank you.
Next, we have Carol Standel Castanon. I apologize if I mispronounced your name. You can go ahead and speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead. Can you hear me? Yes, we can.
Okay thank you. Good evening Mayor and City Council Thank you for your devotion to the well-being of Ojai. My name is Carol Standell Castanon, I've lived in Ojai for nearly 30 years. My sense is that every new generation to Ojai has a vision as to what's best for this community, the community so many of us call home. One way to ensure the diversity of community voices are heard is through the ballot box.
Ojai has chosen to elect a mayor, a two-year term. The mayor represents the majority of voices within the city limits. This voice crosses over City Council districts. The current plan of the elected mayor or two elected City Council members setting the City Council meeting agenda reflects a balanced perspective or vision as well as maintaining the power of the council.
This organizational management during a time of complexity, urgency and competing interests perhaps the council and the mayor are not always in agreement. It is the burden and responsibility of this local governmental organization to be respectful equitable follow the rules Wait, listen and problem solve. As are one of these basic tenets needing to be looked at more closely what is the underlying issue of this body?
It is the duty of this council to honor the majority voice as well as articulate the precise dilemmas of consensus among the mayor and council and community discussions on how the agenda is set is represented at the ballot box. I support the elected mayor's position or the position of two council to set the agenda. I'm also interested in the transparency of our elected city officials on the surface, this includes explicit conflicts of interest between the mayor or council and decisions made on behalf of the citizens of Ojai.
I urge the mayor and council to look more closely at public participation And the inequities of accessibility to city council meetings, how many of our citizens have the opportunity to be informed and or engaged. In the meantime, the will of the majority necessarily needs to be respected. Change and governing happen through facts, discussions, debates and fair and accessible voting.
I strongly support the current protocol for setting the agenda one mayor and or two council members at a time. Thank you for your service in your time tonight.
Thank you Carol.
2:55 – 3:009 turns
Next we have Sue Williamson. Sue Williamson if you're there, if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and speak.
Hi are you can hear me?
Yes we can.
Okay thank you well that's a hard act to follow Carol was incredibly articulate and I'd like to second everything she said I do wanna thank Randy, this is a little off topic but thank you Randy for your consideration about the homeless situation. I'd like to second everything you said that was very considerate and I'd like to see that discussed further. Meanwhile about this issue it just seems, I mean Brian said it himself, it seems like it's making it harder for everyone this proposal And I would agree with that, I really don't understand why you would want to limit people's ability to get things on the agenda.
But I think Mr. Miley answered a lot of those issues by his suggestions in the process, but I think that to change it now would actually as Ryan said make it more difficult for citizens to have input and I think that in these times we really need more input from citizens and We should be making it easier rather than harder for them to get things on the agenda, for us to be able to voice our opinions.
And yes everybody might not have their act together perfectly but you know things don't always have to be decided immediately and there can be time for discussion and I think that's what is needed more is dialogue and conversation to work out these serious divisions that are clearly becoming very pronounced in our country and also in Ojai. So I would just like to say, I think things should stay the way they are two people of the mayor and one other person should be plenty to get an issue on support to have an agenda item.
So that's about all I have to say, thank you very much. Thank you Sue.
Next we have Tom Francis. Tom if you're there you can go ahead and speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead
Good evening, Mayor Sticks and council members. As always I really appreciate your service and appreciate you being here tonight. So I just, you know, there's an irony here that I just want to bring up. And that is that the placement of this agenda item on tonight's agenda by a council minority What I want to make clear. Is that the presently existing protocol allowed council members Haney and Blatt's To raise this question.
In a council meeting two times And less than a year. If what they were suggesting of what they are suggesting were to have occurred, it would not be able Secondly, if a majority of the council votes tonight to bring an end to a minority of the council or the mayor's ability to place items on the council meeting agendas, members of the public with minority opinions may be left with no opportunity to cause the council to publicly discuss a matter of importance to them.
Democracy is sometimes messy, but also delicate. I encourage the council to tread lightly. Thank you.
Thank you Tom.
Oh my God!
Next, we have Patricia Pangeling. I apologize if I mispronounced your name. If you're muted please go ahead and unmute yourself and you can go ahead and speak.
3:00 – 3:0810 turns
Hello! Can you hear me? Yes, we can. Okay, there's a time lag. So excuse the time lag. I just want to second everything that several of the people before me have said. If the majority of the council tonight or anytime wants to change a longstanding protocol, that question should be taken to the voters especially this one and to institute A new protocol, it really needs to be voted on by the public to uphold a fair and democratic process.
And I just want to let all of you know that I do appreciate what you're doing to take care of all the important projects and issues that we're facing now. So that's all I have to say. Thank you. Thank
you,
Patty. And next we have Wendy Lockwood. Wendy, if you're there, if you're muted, excuse me, please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and speak.
I'm here. Thank you everyone. I just have been thinking that as a reminder each and every one of you were elected to represent the community And each and every one of you should have the opportunity to speak for the community. And that includes adding items to council agendas. You're doing the work of the people, and more than that I would just like to say thank you for doing the hard stuff You know, week after week and night after night.
But you are there to represent the people each and every one of you had that job to do so thank you.
Thank you Wendy. And the last person we have is Tara Fay. Tara if you're there you can if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and speak.
All right, thank you. Hi everyone, my name is Tara. I'm here to support Mayor Betsy Sticks. I work for an organization that promotes youth leadership within our community and Mayor Betsy Sticks has really helped to support these young activists by coming to different bootcamp events over the course of the past couple months. She has really helped them all to really believe in their voice And just the fact that they are truly supported by our community leaders.
I really believe that Mayor Betsy Sticks is kind of the voice of the public, and I don't want her voice to kind of be dampened by losing the opportunity to have that ability to bring up Um, I think we all have different ideas at these council meetings. And everybody else that is here kind of put it so eloquently, but I just really want to be here to support the idea that our mayor that was voted by the people in Ojai has that voice.
So yeah, that's all I got to say.
That's it, Gail? Correct. No further public commenters. Okay let's open up for discussion.
Susan?
Oh I just want to add that in addition to the speakers we just heard, we had at least eight comments that were summarized as does not support revising City Council protocols. Just wanted to mention that And then I, I'm not clear. I mean most of what Council Member Randy Haney said, I also support about being civil and respectable and There's bound to be a time when something happens at the last minute that would make us, someone realize that we should postpone something. I don't feel like that was disruptive. I mean, I can see why he might be unhappy about it but I don't see that as a basis to change the protocol. You know?
I agree that we should always be, make sure that we're already as prepared as we can be before we put something on the agenda. I did hear you make a lot of general comments but I don't know specifically there must be some data like How much, what we're doing now to me seems like, I mean there's probably some merit in it but how much time have we really spent on this? Mayor Steeks do you have some idea?
I did some data. It's about 7% of the total meeting time. So approximately five hours was spent I put two items on the agenda, one, both in January request for goal setting workshop and requests to consider adding Jill Ellison for the Clean Power Alliance board. And then there were eight items added by council members 112 Randy and Ryan to review the city protocols 112 Susan billed a direct staff to dedicate streets and Taormina 39, Susan Bill to consider drone delivery regulations. 323, Susan Betsy to discuss safe speed limits. 323, Susan Betsy to review committees on City Hall campus. 325, Susan Betsy to consider an earth-friendly management policy. 622 Ryan and Susa to review and adjust requirements for outdoor dining program permits. 914 Randy and Ryan to review the City Council protocols.
That's again today, and then there was one closed session edited by Bill and Randy to review the city manager's review of city manager so that's five hours total approximately at which totals to be 7% of the total meeting time. And to me all those topics were quite relevant and You know, they take a little more time when we have a lot of people calling in. Which means that people are concerned about those issues.
Any other comments?
3:08 – 3:165 turns
Randy, are you getting ready to go? Randy I had a couple comments but go ahead.
Well I've got quite a few comments but go ahead Bill.
I think that we're kind of missing the point in some respects here. Um, I think Bill Maile actually was pretty good at addressing the issue. And I also want to make it clear to members of the public that commented that council protocols are the council by majority vote deciding how it wants to conduct itself. That's just the way it is. So the idea that, and I'm just going to challenge that idea, the idea that a council is going to put elements on the ballot about how it conducts itself doesn't make a lot of sense. I'll just state that for the record.
I think the issue is pretty much the way that Bill Miley outlined it. City manager and by extension, all the resources of the city manager are managed by the council as a whole. And that's just the form of government we have. And so I think the issue has been moving beyond having matters put on the agenda to discuss versus bringing entire proposals to the council for action before there's been the proper and usual deliberation of, do we want to spend staff time on this? How do we want to look at this?
And I think that's the distinction that I think we've blurred the line with. Am not sure how to address it because you want to have the ability bring issues of concern. But in the past, frankly the existing protocol has been used to bring issues of concern and then we discuss as a council how we want to move forward with addressing those concerns. And that's different from bringing an entire proposal to the council Before we've even had a discussion about how we want to address the concern and how we want to involve staff time in looking into that.
So I'm not sure how to articulate in terms of a change in the protocol, but when we say what our traditional approach has been since I've been on council is that We all have the right through the existing protocols to bring an issue before us, and then we discuss it as a group. How do we want to address this? What's the path forward for looking at this? And that's different from bringing in entire proposal for action in effect displacing that prior step that was traditional.
So I think that's just, that's the concern that I think that I'm hearing from council persons Haney and Blatts but I don't want to speak for them.
Randy and Susan?
So there's you know, I'm not sure if first of all, I'd like to thank the people for speaking. I'm not sure on the name, correct me if I'm wrong with the, I think it was Carol Standall-Skatton. I think she's the second or third person who spoke. First of all, I listened to all of them completely but I was moved by her thought process and her thinking. So I'm not asking anything of anyone that I'm not asking of myself We need to be clear on that.
I'm not putting four people under my bus and putting me ahead of you. The same conditions I'm asking for you, I'm asking of myself. That we respect the agenda that is set. We value it. We value our time together. And we recognize that every time that we throw something in the middle of it, it impacts us. It impacts the community. Now you may not think it does in that moment because someone has reached out to you or a group have reached out to you.
Unless it's an emergency, unless it's life threatening There's no reason it can't be brought to council and talked about and agreed upon by the majority, that is something we should add and move forward on. So I don't think that we're taking anything away from the public. I don't think we're taking anything away from any council person. I think what we're doing is in my goal here Is to make sure that when we meet, that we maximize the time that we're meeting and do take care of the business that's presented before us.
Now if I'm correct on some stats, I don't know why you brought them but I just wanted to clarify. We're in September, I brought this forward in August so how many meetings to date had we had? 18? James, anyone quick at math? Two a month for nine months. And according to Mayor Sticks we had nine insertions into those agendas so half of the agendas had something or someone and I'll own mine thrown into the middle of it And that's what I'm trying to say. We are limited in the time that we have here, it's 1030. We haven't gotten to the most important issue that we should be talking about and why?
So blame it on me for bringing it up. Well guess what? That's the protocols right now takes two of us and two of us did it. And at the end of this discussion, we'll vote. And if we don't move three to two either way, then that's the way it is and we move on. And I want to clarify something else too. I've only done this twice. I think I've done this three times because in the seven years that I've been on council, I've seen this done multiple times So Mayor, please this is not about you. This is about how we perform as a group. You're one of five. I am one of five.
So this is not personal. This is about business and these protocols are about business. How we conduct ourselves? I just think it's important that we recognize that there is an importance to it. So however it goes, it goes. I'm just tired. And I want to spend the time on the community's business, and when we set an agenda we should set it and move on with it.
Any agenda that doesn't include fire, that doesn't include earthquake, that doesn' include the general plan update, and doesn't include water is a failed agenda. And I don't care if that's on the agenda for the rest of my life on this city council. But every time that we don't talk about those three things, right now, we're letting this community down.
3:16 – 3:2718 turns
Susan? So I want to be clear on what you're asking for Council Member Haney You're asking, basically you're asking to take away the elected mayor's ability to put an item on the agenda on his or her own. Is that correct?
And two council people. Let's not make this about one person. I'm putting the focus and the onus on all of us. We agree to an agenda and we agree not to impede it. It's not one, it's all.
Excuse me, but I really want this to be clear. You are asking three things, okay? You're asking that the elected mayor can no longer put an item on the agenda on her own. You're asking that all items on the agenda should be placed at the end of the meeting if three council members agree to it- The majority agreed to it. And I want you to think seriously of the repercussions.
First of all, the people elected the mayor with this... You're basically reducing the role of the mayor back to a ceremonial role by doing that. Secondly, there are time sensitive issues that come up So if we go with only putting things on the agenda, we can't address time-sensitive issues that come up the next day or a week prior to the next agenda. And by asking for three, we are not allowed to discuss The item after the meeting, it has to be put on the agenda to be discussed. I don't object to what Bill Miley suggested and that Council Member Mayor Pro Tem Wyrick agreed with.
I think we could come up with a process if only two people put something on that then they're allowed to explain why Why they wanna put it on the agenda. I mean, I don't see any way maybe the city attorney can help me out here as far as I know if perhaps somebody a council member could put something on the agenda that three council members are not familiar with but that they consider important. I do not see that we have abused The power to put something on the agenda. I have to make sure my battery is plugged in. Hang on, I don't want it to go out.
I see what you're recommending as very problematic. I see nothing but problems and it won't, I don't see that it can resolve the issue because three council members might approve something and then come back with a with a full-blown presentation. The other thing is this, even if the mayor... I believe that we should continue as it stands because the city manager discusses anything that the mayor wants to put on the agenda.
It's discussed with the city manager If he doesn't feel that it's valid or there'll be a discussion, I don't see that the mayor has abused her power to put something on the agenda. If she has then your concern would be valid but there has been no abuse of that power that I've seen and in fact, I don't think she's ever put something on her own. Somebody has seconded but correct me if I'm wrong
I put two things on it in January, to have a workshop and to have Michelle as the alternate. And it took 32 minutes total.
Very appropriate as mayor you know to ask for a workshop like that.
Ryan? I'll just say if everybody feels like the public feels like this is some power grab to steal them power away from there. I'll tell you, I'll just vote against it. But that's not gonna change what I'm about to say. Mayor Sticks, I think your attitude and the way you've handled this tonight is completely inappropriate. I don't know what the accusatory tone is all about. If you go back and watch the video from January, I clearly had no intention nor an agenda about anything. I asked over and over again to Matt Summers exactly what other cities did in similar situations to get a better concept of it. If you watch that meeting, it would be crystal clear to you that that is not at all would occur. In addition to that, I voted against it that night because I didn't think it was a good idea to not have some escape valve as Matt called it in our meeting.
Because I was concerned that if we had to vote on it at one meeting and we had to wait until the next thing to put something agenda that that was too much time. So I voted against it not because I thought we needed three people Randy brought up that idea and it didn't get seconded. So I just, I don't understand where this conspiratorial attitude and tone that I think you've led with and some of the public has probably followed in whatever you guys thought was going on. But it's just 100% incorrect.
Worrying about this anymore. I couldn't care less, I thought it was a good idea to make us as a body stop looking like we were discussing the wrong thing over and over again in a public attitude that things were not doing a very good job. I would draw that clearly the discussion about its made us look even worse which is not my intent at all. So I'm voting no, I have no intention of keeping any power out of the mayor's hands and I don't think anything that you seem to insinuate about how I did anything in January is true at all.
Well, Ryan, I watched the video. So I encourage you to watch the video because it's right there and two people put things on the agenda. Let me finish. I listen to you. Listen to me. Two people put on the agenda. It has to be two people and it was you. And, you know, you're using the words tone and conspiracy. That's your perception. I'm not talking about any conspiracy. And from my perspective, my tone has been completely civil and respectful I'll go
back and watch the video.
Yeah, please do because it couldn't have gotten on the agenda without both of you in
December. I don't believe I put it on the agenda. I can't even find it in the minutes anywhere. I've been looking because I don' remember that at all and frankly if I did again it has nothing to do with trying to usurp any power out of the mayor's seat That's not what I'm saying. The idea that you're connecting, bringing protocols back to something to do with intending to do something to the mayor seat is just completely-
Well no,
I'm not saying
that. The proposal is to have three people do it which means taking the power away from the mayor or two council members. So there's no... Please stop interrupting me. Let's have some civility, two people put things on the agenda you know watch the video it has to be two otherwise it never would have gotten on the agenda so please watch the video and please don't assign I'm just looking for the truth and I want to support democracy. And I really feel, you know, I thought Michelle Ellison wrote a great letter in which she said that it's really important for the minority to be able to express a voice. That's tenet of democracy. I'm surprised that's something that you're not supporting to two council
members. I just told him, I'm going to vote for it. What do you think? I'm not supporting this idea that I'm somehow, I mean, I just don't understand where again, you're doing it and then saying you're And I have to tell you, there was nothing in December when you weren't even on the council that anybody was putting on an agenda. And the idea of protocols is so expansive that wasn't even the main focus of that particular agenda item. In fact, the yay votes on that particular vote that night voted to keep the protocols the same. That was against it because-
Bill and Susan and I voted to keep it the same way. You and Randy voted to change it.
No, I voted that I didn't like the idea that we had to vote at a council meeting in case we needed to have something done in between. And I discussed that in the meeting. That's why I just don't understand. Again, I have no intent of usurping any of the power from you. There wasn't any of this. I've already told you I'm gonna vote no but I don't appreciate that it feels like you have had an accusatory tone and if I don' bring that up, I think I wouldn't be doing my job.
Well, I'm sorry you think I have an accusatory tone. I don't think I do, and this is open for discussion. Randy?
So we're getting into personalities and I keep saying this. This isn't about any individual. It's about a body and how we operate. If we keep the discussion at that level and on that, we'll come to some conclusions. We'll come to some answers. We'll come to some way to work this out. Again, no one's asking anyone to get any more power if that's what this seems to be.
No one is saying that no one in the community can't go to a council member and that council member can't bring their concern or issue to council. This doesn't stop that. If it does, someone tell me because that's not the intent. We didn't say that. I didn't ask for that. I asked that when things are brought to council that they're talked about in the chamber, they're fully vetted. We all agree that that's an important issue we put it on the agenda.
If it's not an important issue in that moment, it doesn't mean it won't be in two weeks or in two months. It means in that moment, it's not as important as what's in front of us. That's what it does. So that's what this is all about. Contrary to what anyone thinks or feels or wants to think and feel, this is about how we function period.
3:27 – 3:329 turns
We cannot discuss items that are not on the agenda. That's the bottom line, so I don't understand what you're saying doesn't make any sense to me at all Council Member Haney because and what is your logic for asking three? The majority to why do you need three people I mean, I would hope that if you wanna put something on the agenda that I don't understand or that I may not think is important. I have enough respect for you to allow you to do that. I would trust that you would not abuse the privilege of putting something on the agenda. I'm perfectly fine with one other person seconded it. I do not see the need for three For three people, I don't see how that will solve the problem.
And we cannot discuss items that are not on the agenda. We can only ask that they be put on the agenda.
We can't discuss them now if they're not agendized. You're, you're not making any sense. You can talk to any council member outside of the body about anything that any individual comes up to you and wants to talk about. You can't talk to three. If you bring it to council all I'm trying to say is let the majority say that's something that we want to move forward. You, I'm not saying you can't share it with us, you'd have to share it with us.
In that moment. So all I'm saying is to put it on the agenda and then move it forward, you need the majority of council. So I don't know what you're saying now here's the opposite of what you're saying. Why don't we eliminate the two and put everyone having the opportunity at any time to put anything on the agenda? Well, I think we should- Why don't we just do that? I'd be happy with that.
It's an equal playing field. We're all elected officials, we're all voted on, no one is any better than the other. Let's simplify it.
Well, and yet though the elected mayor comes with that authority to put something on the agenda. So, and that's what the people voted for so if you'd like to change that
I don't know where I don' know how many voters read the protocols before they voted. And I'm also going to assume based on a lot of interactions with the past mayor and a little bit with you that sometimes people think you have more power than what you have. You're a council member, a glorified council member with six things that are a little greater than us and you get to do some things out in the public that we don't do although you can choose not to go and ask one of us to represent you or represent this city but all's I'm trying to say here is I'm trying to create an environment where we cut out repetition and we do the people's business. That's what this is all about.
I'm ready to make a motion, let's just get a vote on this and let's move on. Okay go ahead.
I'll make a motion if you're not ready
So, I'm going to follow the recommendation that the City Council consider their request to placing items on council agenda with the majority of the body approving it at that session. Does that make sense? Do I need to... Matt you need to help me out with that at all?
As I understand the motion it would be to require Um, for items to be placed on the agenda by any member of council at a meeting at the future agenda items portion of the meeting. The request would be one makes the request requires consent by two more three total for an item to be placed on a council agenda that's legal because all that would be discussed if that were to happen would be shall the item be on the agenda or not? That's it. That's what makes it legal because we would be listing And the motion is to direct staff to rewrite the protocols to that effect.
Thank you as I understand it,
I have a question if I want to make an alternate motion do I make it now or after? Or we wait we vote and see how that goes
uh procedurally next steps would be first is there a second the motion dies for lack of a second so be it if there is a second then you could make a substitute ornamented motion from But having viewed the meeting, it may be reasonable to see if there's a second.
3:32 – 4:1123 turns
So- No.
Okay. There it dies. Motion? My motion is that we keep the city council protocols the same. Wait
a second. Did I get a second?
Council Member Haney, I do not believe you received a second
Then this dies. Stays the same. Let's move on.
That is correct,
there's
no need to take
a further vote.
Okay all right thank you. Mayor Sticks would you indulge me with just an inquiry? Sure so do we still have an understanding among us and do we need to make it explicit not tonight that when a an item is brought to the agenda on the way we just approved There is the understanding that council has to meet to decide, to utilize staff time before it proceeds. We all in that understanding?
Yes.
Okay.
Yeah and I agree we can always do better. We can make it a better system so let's work to do that.
But just the principle that we as a body of five manage the city manager and city staff time.
Yes I agree
thank you.
Okay, thank you. All right let's move on to the last item number four it's the draft of the 2021-2029 housing element update and so we're going to receive public comments and provide comments and this is the first of three meetings
yes thank you we have a brief I will keep it brief it was actually about 20 slides but we'll try to get through them fairly quickly real quick Real quick, point of order?
Yes. It's 10, looks like almost 1045. And are we done at council at 1030? Yeah
I would request, I know that that's our general procedure, I would request with the housing element and the looming state deadline, I think this is pretty critical to get through tonight.
You can do it.
All right, thanks
James. So I will try to keep it brief. We're actually bringing the housing element to council today actually a little bit ahead of schedule which is nice under the circumstances we're still working through some issues Myself and the Community Development Director met with state representatives from the Housing HCD, and we're still working through some issues. But we wanted to bring the housing element to council now because it's a lengthy document as you probably saw in your packet. It's about 187 pages.
And we wanted to kind of get everybody to start thinking about it with the idea that we'll have a second review of it on September 28th and ultimately adoption on October 12th. The housing element per the state requirements has to be adopted by October 15th, there is a quote unquote grace period that they build into that but we're aiming to try to get it adopted by October 15th to be in compliance which would be an accomplishment because with COVID with how long things take to get back from the state and other groups I don't think many agencies are actually on track to hit that October 15th date, and so we'll give some more information on that in the presentation as well. But so I will say this is an early review. We're trying to get the information to the public into the City Council.
We don't have to dig into it completely today especially at this late point but this will give the opportunity for Council either ask questions or to send us some comments or feedback in coming days so with that I'll kind of quickly go through the housing element. As a reminder, this is part of our general plan update. Our general plan update will update multiple elements in what we're calling our Ojai 2045 plan. The housing element is being talked about first because it is the one element that is required to be adopted by a certain date by the state so that's why we had to kind of pull this out. I saw a public comment that came in today Asked why this is being handled separately and noted that it's kind of, I think the wording was something along the lines of like the cart before the horse.
I think that the reality is because of the way this is set up and because of the fact that the state has to certify it by October 15th. It is somewhat true that we're kind of getting out in front of the rest of the general plan update, but it's par for the course. And we'll have some opportunities as we adopt this and then we go to the general plan update. We'll have opportunities to still tweak and fine tune it during our general plan updates. So with that just a basic overview for someone who's watching who might not know what a housing element is. It's one of our seven required elements in our general plan The housing element, one of the goals is that it should plan for the city obtaining its fair share of housing.
We have a slide coming up on this in a couple slides explaining how the state determines the fair share of housing allocation for the region, the Southern California region And how that is then sent out to the counties and then in each county, how there's a number sent out to the city. This housing element helps is supposed to help us plan for meeting our fair share of those numbers.
The housing element also includes a lot of data, a lot of information about the city's housing needs, about the population, about our community we serve and how we can accommodate and address the needs of the community. It also sets goals, objectives and policies for housing. One example that was in our last housing element that we accomplished pretty well and that will also be in the upcoming one is our accessory dwelling unit goals and objectives and policies. The city through our last housing element set ADUs as a priority and I think Hopefully the community feels like we've accomplished treating those as a priority. And that's something that will probably be built into the next housing element as well.
The housing element I mentioned earlier, it's kind of being pulled out in front of the general plan update. That's because it is required to be updated every eight years and in some circumstances if cities don't adopt them on time, it can be required to be updated every four years So by being on pace for our October 15th adoption, we would avoid potentially going to a four year cycle which would be very frequent for a city in our circumstances where things do not typically change drastically in four years.
And then lastly, our deadline in Ventura County and in Southern California is October 15th. The state, we have to adopt it and then the state will have to review it and certify it. And so we've had a few comments that we've received during the process as well when this has gone through planning commission and others. We had comments from people who said why are you so concerned with what the state is requiring? And the reason is because the state has to certify the housing element. So similar to the redistricting conversation we had earlier today A lot of these come from the state down.
They are essentially one size fits all solutions that are being kind of pushed to the cities. Obviously Ojai, we are not a one size fits all city. I think we see that both with the redistricting and how that doesn't quite fit the community the way it may in a city like Los Angeles. Similarly our housing element or The housing allocations and the housing needs doesn't really fit the city of Ojai when we're a community that has actually had a decreasing population in the past, which is not typical in the state of California. And we'll get into a little bit of that and I'll try to speed it up. I know it's late so just a couple other points. A lot of people believe that the map and the housing overlay sites are sites that the city will build housing in but that's not actually the case.
It's sites that the city The city does not typically build housing, although we have a couple of projects that we've identified that we may try to partner with groups to do so. But that's not required by the housing element. What the housing element requires is for the city to use our funds policies and or programs to incentivize housing and for us to plan Aligning the zoning ordinance, planning documents and our general plan and housing element. So what happens if we don't certify it? Or why are we concerned with the state approving this plan? It's because there's potential penalties.
First off, there's the risk of litigation. HCD on behalf of the state will monitor for non-compliance and will report cities to the attorney general if they do not adopt and certify a housing element. Courts have imposed fines up to $100,000 per month and cities have been sued with Pleasanton recently losing its ability to permit or regulate building. And so for us those are definitely consequences that would not be beneficial for the city especially if the city were to lose its right to permit And also to a lesser extent, because we don't receive a lot of grant funding through these programs. But we also would become ineligible for state grant opportunities. Right now, we estimate we have a couple hundred thousand dollars a year on these state grant opportunities.
So that really is not the critical piece for us. Again this is where Ojai's unique. Other cities that receive millions of dollars in these funds you know that might be the motivation. For us it is more about maintaining our ability Zone and regulate and permit appropriately. And those issues discussed above, so that's background on the housing element and why it's important and why we are working hard to stay in compliance with that.
Now the next question people may ask is what kind of information is in the housing element? We have an attached version in our packet but It includes a variety of topics. One thing it includes is demographic information and it's actually, it's interesting I think you know it's 187 pages. I think some parts of it people would say are dry but it's very interesting looking at some of the population trends and the income trends and homelessness trends I think a lot of questions people ask us frequently are answered in this housing element based on the most recent 2020 data. And so we'll go over a couple of those pieces, but there's 187 pages of this information in the packet.
One point I made earlier, our population trends are explained in the housing element. Again, Ojai is unique. Our population decreased between 1990 to 2020, which is very unusual. Whenever we meet with new consultants on these projects they always ask if that's a typo the first time around because it's not typical in Southern California but it's the case in Ojai.
The most recent projections are that there'd be expected growth of 4.5% by 2045 Which would actually put us just slightly above the population we had in 2000. So still not the typical growth seen in Southern California cities. And so that information is included, or that type of information because obviously one of the questions is how many more people are we expecting in the city that we would need to have housing identified for?
And so again, Ojai has a little bit of a unique story with that. And I would say unique in most of these areas actually another area that Ojai is unique in is the number of households in Ojai that are senior headed households. We definitely have the oldest population in the county I want to say our average age of Ojai residents at this point, I don't have it in front of me but I believe it was 53 years old. And I believe Oxnard by comparison was 35 so a pretty big difference. 40% of our households are headed by seniors 20% of our households are seniors who are living alone those are all much higher numbers than you'd expect in most cities Some additional categories that we look at and discuss in the housing element. Our homeless number has increased somewhat, I believe from 40 last cycle to 49 or 40 last year to 49 this year.
And so we have 0.6 of our population is homeless for the housing element. We also have a pretty high percentage of small households We show that here in the inverse, that our large households of five or more account for only 4.7% of our households. Most of our households are two to three people and again those are all kind of areas where we're unique versus ours compared to cities like Oxnard or Ventura where it's typically younger larger households than what Another thing that I would say actually surprised us or surprised me, I'll say.
I think my perception has always been in my mind that Ojai is more owner-occupied houses than the rest of the county but when we looked at that more closely, we found that's not true according to our statistics Ojai in our most recent reporting is 47% renter-occupied households, 53% owner occupied versus Ventura County's actually 63% owner occupied and 37% renter occupied.
We're closer to the state average, the state norm. We still have a little bit more of a renter occupied background than the state but it's close But we are much more renter occupied than the county, the remainder of the County of Ventura. And that number is actually decreasing from... The number of owner-occupied housing units has actually been decreasing since 2010.
I mentioned this earlier, the age of households and I'm sorry, the age of... This is a little different. It's the age of our housing stock and that's another category where we actually are comparable to the county but I think this would not surprise most people to see that we don't have much new development. New housing units built since 2010 is 0.1%, less than 1% whereas Number of housing units from 1939 or earlier is over 10%.
And you can see a big chunk of our housing structures were built in the 50s, 60s and 70s. I think that is not as surprising and it speaks to we have a lot of landmarked housing structures and we don't have a lot of new development so That's not necessarily surprising, but it just speaks to the fact that we mentioned earlier that there is not a lot of new development in Ojai and that's where again this arena allocations don't necessarily jive with what we expect from the city moving forward.
With that, there's a couple more kind of demographic pieces of information. Another area that I think has been referenced by the City Council previously when we talk about the need for affordable housing and that Ojai has one of the lowest household incomes in the county. The housing element reflects that We show that 15% of Ojai households would be considered extremely low income, as compared to 11.5% in the county.
Our very low is almost equal with the county just a little bit higher, 11.8% versus 11.7%. And then low and moderate are close to the county levels but overall we have 40% of the households at Ojai would be considered Low income households, although that ranges between extremely low to the moderate or above category. Or I'm sorry, the extremely low to the low category.
We do have a pretty high percentage or a higher percentage than the rest of the county of those of the extremely low categories. Regarding housing affordability, So we just went over the fact that our income levels per household are, that we have a high percentage of extremely low. That's particularly challenging because what we found is that Ojai also has the highest median home sales price in the county at $934,500 as of October of 2020 and so You can start to see quickly where the challenges are when we say that we have one of the largest numbers in the county of extremely low income.
But then, we have the highest sales price of housing in the county and you can understand quickly why or how we get Some of the numbers in the housing element related to stressed households and households that pay more than a certain percentage of their income towards housing. That's something that's particularly challenging at Ojai. The bullet point here on this slide notes that housing is considered affordable if a household pays less than 30% of their income on housing costs, What we are finding in Ojai is that Ojai is one of the cities that has the fewest amount of households that would be considered affordable for the income level that it, that the residents obtain.
And so this gives some more information when we talked about 15% of our households being the extremely low category The income limit for an extremely low housing, I believe this is a two-person household. The income limit is $27,100 so family of two whether it's a husband and wife or a father son or whatever the combination is. A two-person household making $27,100 or less would be considered extremely low income.
And so when we try to estimate what rent can be afforded for 15% of our community, the rent that would be affordable would be $500 per month. I think all of us know immediately that it's very hard to find any rent in that price range I don't remember the last time I saw a rent advertised at $500 a month. And so that speaks to the fact that for those people making under 27,100 there probably is no affordable rent in Ojai in those categories at this point. To purchase a house what would be considered an affordable home price to purchase at that income level is $70,000.
Again, I cannot remember the last time I saw Any property in the Ojai Valley for under that amount. So you start to see quickly where the stress level comes from on these. Similarly, for very low income household of two, you can make $45,000 and still be considered a very low income if you're a household of two. The affordable rent for that category would be $950 and an affordable housing price for that category is $145,000 Both of those numbers are still well below the average. And then for low income, a household of two is up to $72,000. For moderate income, a household of two is up to 93,900 dollars.
And I think again for that category it's worth noting a household of two that's making 93,900 dollars an affordable home price Those two people would be considered $350,000. And again our median sale price a year ago was $934,000 so you can see where the gaps are pretty clearly again with our community having a lower income level as compared to the rest of the county but a much higher sales price as compared to the rest of the county.
And so all that information and a lot more, I'm trying to kind of unpack it quickly. But a lot of additional information is in the housing element. It's worth reading to kind of see those trends and understand it. I think we all kind of have an idea of these trends but it really puts it clear in black and white and amplifies just how difficult it is right now That's affordable for most of our communities.
So with that in mind, we get what is called a regional housing needs assessment allocation and that's what we mean when we refer to RANA numbers. As I mentioned earlier the way it works is the state designates a number to the Southern California region which is this total SCAG number So Southern California as a region was asked to identify 1,341,827 possible housing units that would need to be planned for as part of this housing element. Of that 1,341,000 24,000 were allocated to Ventura County Which you can see on this chart is actually one of the lower numbers sent to a county.
And then of those 24,000 in Ventura County, those were then allocated to cities with Ojai receiving 53 of those units. We participated and the city council directed staff and authorized staff to participate in all of the hearings to try to get a realistic number for Ojai. And so as a result of that, the number for Ojai was 53 housing units. And so obviously it ranges pretty greatly. You see that Ojai has 53 units. You see that Oxnard has 8,549. So Oxnard is going to have to plan for potentially adding 8,549 housing units and We received the lowest allocation and Oxnard received the highest, but that gives you an example of the range from city to city.
Importantly for us when you compare the allocation to the last cycle which is coming to an end, the fifth cycle our number was reduced pretty dramatically we had 371 housing units allocated to us in the fifth cycle Which is, was difficult to plan for. I think we've all heard the stories when this went through the process the last time and the city had to find sites that really were very unlikely to be developed but it was just because in a city four square miles that's pretty built out it's hard to identify 371 new units This current allocation, the six cycles allocation of 53 units is much more realistic and much more in line with I think what we would actually expect to see.
And so those 53 units, the state are identifying that 13 of those units would be very low income units Nine would be low, 10 would be moderate and 21 would be above moderate. I think those numbers are actually fairly obtainable for us particularly when we've been seeing many ADU units through our second unit compliance program and some of our other ADU permitting programs.
I believe in our housing element, we estimated that we would expect to see another 60 in the next eight years. 60 plus. So we potentially could reach our housing needs number with only ADUs if needed. Actually, I should have gone to this slide a minute ago. This shows that over the last three years, we've had 65 ADUs ADUs, junior ADUs are legalized units. And so those if we continue at that rate, we would hit our 53 units pretty easily during this eight year period.
One of the other things that's included in the housing element that is a hot topic and that is typically the focus of a lot of the discussion is what's referred to as the SPL overlay The SPL overlay is the site map that shows particular sites that the city has identified for affordable housing. And those are the sites that we have to identify a minimum number of units for, which again in the past was 350. This cycle will only be 53 units.
When we identify those sites, those property owners receive an entitlement to potentially build more dense affordable housing. And so the positive is that it encourages affordable housing. The negative and the reason you don't just identify every site within the city as a SPL overlay is because the city loses some of the ability to review and regulate those sites So you typically only want to put the SPL overlay on sites where you really want to encourage affordable housing at all costs, essentially.
And so the city's current allocation as I mentioned is 53 units. We mentioned in the staff report that when this first started going through the process, the rumor was what we had heard from other cities who had heard back from the state was that they were requesting a huge buffer Up to eight times the allocation. So there were, for example with our 53 units it would have been similar to the state requiring 400 units as a buffer which is pretty unusual and we were hoping was not the case so we've been working with the state. We've been working with our consultants to try to find out what the state will really accept as a buffer Um, we are looking at the upcoming housing element.
And so we have heard recently that the state has been accepting a more reasonable 30% buffer. Which essentially means for us to satisfy our requirements and get the state certification. We should plan Because of that process, we worked with the Planning Commission to identify a bunch of sites in case we needed to add a couple hundred units. But the positive news is because the state has come back with a more reasonable 30% buffer, our current sites which are currently estimated at units per 95 to 136 units, Allocation would already satisfy our RENA requirements.
And so what that means, I know that's starting to get technical but what that means is laid out here. This map shows the existing sites from our last housing element that is coming to an end, the fifth cycle which ends October 15th These sites are the ones that are currently designated. The two in red, 408 South Ventura Street and 111 West Santa Ana Street are the City Hall campus.
And so we've identified those in red because we recommended and worked with the Planning Commission, and the Planning Commission affirmed that and also recommended removing those two sites from the overlay. There's a variety of reasons, but one reason is just that it's typically if there's no plan to actually build and develop affordable housing on a site. You shouldn't just add the site because the state wants to know that the sites you're identifying will have a legitimate opportunity to be developed. I think what we're seeing right now with all of our sewer canyon restoration, potential climate park Some of the other programming, some of which we talked about tonight like the Children's Memorial.
It is not realistic at this point that these sites will be developed in eight years and so we are recommending removing those but that leaves the sites that are in white. Those are on the current housing element and we are recommending keeping them on the next housing element on the next SPL overlay Those sites include some notable sites. 408 North Montgomery is the city site that we've talked about potentially having a five unit or so affordable housing project at different times, and we're currently working on that.
1202 East Ojai Avenue is the old bowling alley site. 318 Bryant Street is the condor storage site on Bryant Bryant Street, 510 and 450 East Ojai Avenue is the skate park. It's 450 which it's the skate park in front but it's got a large parcel behind it so that still potentially could be developed for affordable housing with the focus on that back part not on the skate park which we have a 20-year lease on.
It's that parcel and the parcel next to it, which is the old foundry building, Miller Building. That is just the building with nothing else on the parcel. That's also on our overlay and we're recommending you keep it on the overlay. And then 312 South Blanche Street is on the overlay as well, and we're just recommending keeping that on the overlay at this point.
Actually I think we're recommending removing that. Let me, I'll confirm that but I think that one's actually being recommended to remove too. We just forgot to mark it in red. So I mentioned this earlier but we just wanted to dig in a little bit to it so when we went to Planning Commission we asked them to be prepared and to do some of the legwork on identifying additional sites if additional units were needed And at that time, we thought that additional units would be needed. So they did do a review and they identified additional sites which are shown on this map. Again, at this point with us getting the further clarification from the state, the staff is not recommending adding sites for a variety of reasons at this point but this information is included in the packet and it's available If we need to identify additional sites, but we just don't think we do at this point.
And so what we are recommending is again, to go back to that slide before we are recommending removing the city hall sites, which there really are no plans to develop and we're recommending keeping the existing sites, which puts us at about a hundred units depending on how that's calculated, More than we need for the state's reign of requirements. And so this will probably be the focus of most conversation, but we wanted to just briefly note another useful or another key piece of information in the housing element are the programs that the city is implementing to help encourage affordable housing There's 18 of them. I won't go through all of them, but you know certain key ones have been pretty effective and in our meeting with the state we bragged about a couple of them such as increasing the supply of accessory dwelling units which is added More units than we've ever been able to add in Ojai, so that's been very successful.
I think the other one I want to point out is one that the Planning Commission actually proposed to be added as a new program is a program to demonstrate alternative housing materials which is something that's been talked about a lot at different planning commission meetings throughout That was a new program. Most of the other programs listed here are existing programs, but we just wanted to call them out because they are key parts of our housing element and us showing that we really are trying to encourage affordable housing.
And so there's approximately 18 with like I mentioned the one demonstrating alternative Building materials would be the new program that the Planning Commission's recommended. Another key one that I'm sure we'll receive comments on is the sustainability and energy conservation. We've added some language to that, pointing out that by conserving energy you're also keeping prices low for utilities which helps address affordability so things like that do tie into affordable housing.
4:11 – 4:1818 turns
Did you already do number 16? Did I miss it?
No, I wasn't going through these one by one but we could talk about ones if there's questions on them. The anti-displacement policies is essentially the... It's our policies that are in our city code that require like the like for like housing and those types of things And so that's what that program is referring to.
It's
items embedded in our city code and in our policies that help prevent displacement,
so. Susan remember that's the ordinance we utilized when the cottages of Mallory came up?
Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah.
So those are the programs that are included. There's 18 of them in our housing element at this point. We are talking to HCD and we talked to them today, and they're supposed to give us a response about whether again, whether they have updated their position on whether tiny homes would count towards ADUs and our RANA numbers. And if that does then that would be a potential program that could be added If we move forward with the tiny home programs.
And so again, I know it's late. I know that's dumping a lot of information but again the good news is we're actually here meeting earlier than then we would need to be and where Our goal is to kind of give the information, get everybody started thinking about it. If you have any thoughts or comments or feedback, you can provide those to us either now or between now and the next meeting.
And then our next steps for this process is that we met with HCD from the state this morning but they are going to give us written comments on Friday by end of day Friday So we are going to continue our review of the housing element at our next council meeting on the 28th, and that will also include the ability for us to then review what the state has commented on.
And then the plan will still be to adopt the housing element on October 12th at that council meeting with whatever feedback we receive from the council public and from the state That would be three days prior to the state deadline of October 15th. As I mentioned, there is a 120 day grace period but we're trying to adopt it by the 15th and I think we are actually in a pretty good position to be able to do that.
And so if any council member wants to provide feedback that could be included for the next discussion on September 28th Because of the timeline, we would need to have that fairly quickly by about the end of this week to be able to put it into the next package. But again, we still have that October 12th review as well so it's not the last opportunity at this point.
And so what we are going to be recommending when we come back on that we are going to recommend adopting the housing element with the existing sites, which should meet the state requirements by the deadline. And if council has any interest in really exploring any additional sites, then what we'd do is we adopt the existing sites but we would note to the state that we were going to do the environmental review and an update As part of our general plan update to include additional sites, if desired.
So that's the plan at this point. I know I probably talked too long but this is just to kind of get everybody's will spinning and we'll take any feedback or we can come back and talk about it more in depth on September 28th.
Well, we are anyway right?
Yep.
Yeah.
Thank you, James. Thank you. Any questions?
Bill? A quick comment. I really think it's important in interacting with HCD to point out that what we're talking about is expanding the definition of ADU. We're not adding a new category of housing. We're trying to expand the flexibility of ADUs with tiny homes in the two-step process with the permitting for the site and the actual house itself. And that goes, and I want to emphasize it, that goes along with the theme that we've been doing for years, and that is going beyond the necessary in terms of allowing for ADUs and trying to make it easier under the compliance program to get ADUs Weren't built with permits permitted.
When I read through this, on a couple of pages like on 67 where they talk about the ADUs it almost acts like just to read really quick the city last updated its ADU ordinance in 2020 reflects several state law changes. Our initiative on ADUs has not just been reactive and it kind of comes across as just being reactive we've been more And I just would not want to sell us short on what we've been doing. Just a comment.
Randy?
Just a couple questions, Mayor. So first of all, James, you said that we have about 59 or 60 ADUs
built in three years? Your microphone, I think is off. Sorry. I think I heard the question.
59 or 60 ADUs in the last three years?
63 in the last three years, I
believe. And do we know what people are charging rent for them if they're for rent?
4:18 – 4:2623 turns
I was trying to think of if there's a way we could find that out. Here and there when we've talked to some property owners, I don't think we know like firm what each of them are charging.
So in regards to Reina numbers, we don't know what they're actually impacting? Is it low? Is it medium? Is is high?
ADUs get to count as moderate by default. They count them against the moderate metric, if we had an ADU that was de-restricted to be cheaper or more affordable at lower or very low then we would still count it but we get to count ADUs by default of moderate.
By design they're deemed moderate by design right? I'm sorry it's probably accurate as well because if you recall
As we mentioned, moderate means estimated rent of $2,200. And I think most of us have probably seen some of the ADU ads lately that are $1,800-$2,000 so they are in that range.
So I guess what I'm leading to is as it stands right now, any of the housing stock that is built unless there's some type of restriction or something of that nature placed on it, there is no control. That's the first thought. The second one is on the SPLs When we designate a property, especially private property, do we send them a letter stating what we're doing? Are we required to do that?
And
if they receive it and don't want to be on it, do they have a right to not be on it?
No. They do not have a right to object. The city has a right to zone these properties as the council may desire. I believe that staff has been in discussion with most, if not all of the property owners and that's what I'm going to turn it back to James regarding those discussions.
Yes we've notified each person who's been, each property that was identified whether we ended up recommending it or not on here we've notified That they potentially could be added to the site.
And I guess why I asked that question is again, I've had people in the C1 area being asked to be put on this overlay and I was just wondering why we would even overlay something in the commercial district but that's another question.
Yeah, I want to say our existing sites has one that's a C1 I believe which I believe is the bowling alley and so That would be the one, again. I know the Planning Commission looked at a bunch of different sites and I think one or two of those was also commercial but with our recommendation at this point, the bowling alley would be the one that would stand
out as a commercial.
Thanks,
Jude. 510 East Ojai may also be commercially zoned? I believe it's PL but we could confirm that. Oh is that PL2? Okay.
Other questions? Susan,
question. So the 47% is renters 53% owner occupied and that 53% includes second and third homes that are hardly ever occupied
correct? Yes The only thing I'm not sure of that we can find out and we can report back on at the next meeting, if they have a second home in Ojai and they identify as living in their first home, I'm not sure if they're counted in the owner-occupied category. So that'd be something we'd have to look at a little closer.
I'm curious about that because if there's enough of them, we can possibly discuss that tax for under
Yeah, we'll bring that back at the report back on the 28th.
Okay thank you. Any public comments on this item Gail?
Yes we have two speakers uh the first one is Bill Miley Mr. Miley, you can speak now if you're unmuted. Please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and talk. I
am still here. I can't believe it! For the record my name is Bill Miley and I'm one of those older folks you talk about. So I've read the entire draft and have a few comments Number one is appreciation. This is a huge undertaking and I know it represents massive amounts of time, energy and thought by many planning department commission consultant to public council.
So I want to recognize your contributions and applaud all of you including me. It seems that our city has a much higher age population than others and will be needing much more affordable residents in the future. The need for units is greater than the supply. Number three, the number of SPL overlays affordable housing. I've been attending planning commissions ever since this started and I have been aware of the current draft sites recommended to meet to the regional housing requirements After reading about the recent state communication provided by a housing consultant that only 30% is needed, I want to support James and Lucas in their recommendation not to add the five proposed sites because we're okay. The recommendation of the planning commission was using an older designation for guidelines Number four, protect the future zoning and protect future limited water supplies.
When you have a SPL overlay it's a buy right by law and if you carry it forever we don't need all of those especially considering that we want to protect our water supplies in the future with the Western drought growing every year we need to be cautious about buy right assignments who knows They may, if we don't do it, we may save our having to have the wells go dry and the lake go dry.
Number five I'm going to skip number six alternate housing material demonstration brand new this is a great chance to look at alternate construction materials We should take advantage of it. And last, conservation and rehab. This section addresses the need for keeping what we have in affordable livable. It's in my opinion a major need is weatherization requirements for wall installation didn't happen till about the 1960s so we have a lot of older homes. Habitat for Humanity in addition to building homes does rehabbing. I'd like our city to actively connect with Habitat, to make some of our more affordable homes more efficient, energy efficient and that's all thanks.
Thank you Bill.
4:26 – 4:3222 turns
Next we have Steve Colame Mr. Colame you can go ahead and speak if you're muted please unmute yourself and you can go ahead and talk He's in the queue, but he doesn't seem to be picking up.
Maybe Steve went to bed.
He could have. Yeah. I'll go ahead and put him back, remove him from the permission. OK. Thank
you, Gail.
Let's
wind it up.
OK, moving on to discussion.
I say we
discuss next time. I know that there's one more person who signed up, Tom Francis do you see him Gail?
He's still in the queue he's not signed up for this item but i can open him up to talk if he wants to speak okay thank
you
There whoops where'd he go he disappeared He's no longer, oh there he is.
There.
Tom Francis if you're there you can go ahead and unmute yourself and you can speak.
You guys hear me okay?
Yes. All
right thank you for giving the opportunity I did sign up to speak I'm not sure what happened. Anyway, again I appreciate y'all being here especially so late. My comments are fairly brief. So it mostly relates to water. Relative to most centuries the 20th century was a very wet century. Sadly most of the water supply systems in our valley were engineered during this wet period.
In our valley and throughout the Western United States we're not just experiencing severe extended drought We're also experiencing aridification, which is the gradual change of a region from a wetter to a drier climate. These facts render our present water supply system, which was predicated on this wet century, unreliable for most or all of the coming RHNA eight year cycle.
As former mayor Johnny Johnson says, if you find yourself in a hole stop digging. Council member Wyrick In the context of water supply in the Ojai Valley, this means stop approving new water wells even when it is for your friends or for development you really want to make happen. New water wells do not generate more water they simply further reduce the amount of water we'll be relying on to survive a ridification.
Further 2020 urban management plan The Casitas Municipal Water District, which supplies most of the water to the city of Ojai is projecting we could reach stage five restrictions by 2023 where watering outdoors would be severely limited and stage six restrictions by 2026. They do not discuss stage seven if there is such a thing. I respectfully request that the City Council direct the city manager to formally request that the California Department of Housing and Community Development grant the City of Ojai a waiver of any and all RHNA requirements as soon as possible due to lack of critical infrastructure, i.e., a reliable water supply In our present circumstances, planning for more development flies in the face of the geophysical limits our planet is communicating to us.
Thank you.
Thank you Tom. All right we'll move to discussion.
Yeah Mayor Sticks just a response just as a matter of fact I have no idea what Mr Francis talked about in terms of my approving on the OBGMA board wells supporting development I have no idea what he's talking
about. I was at that meeting, there were two wells approved, the Little Hawk well and some other well recently on OBGMA. I think that might
be it. They had nothing to do with development. They were bedrock wells for their individual domestic use. They weren't part of development anyway.
Any other comments? You guys okay? Well, I one James thank you for that great report and I really appreciate you explaining it because I think most of us have when we hear affordable. We think it's actually affordable for people and that word doesn't really mean much anymore so in terms of very low and extremely low income I think you taught us well You know, we just don't have that available at this point so I appreciate that. And I would like to make a motion.
It is possible due to lack of critical infrastructure and Randy, to reiterate water. We need to talk about water all the time so we don't have a reliable water source at this point. So that would be my motion.
4:32 – 4:3824 turns
I feel like I'm just too tired to think clearly could we put that Could we come back to that next time?
Yeah. Is that possible, Matt
and
Jeanette? It's a good idea because I think we can In our report, when we come back on the 28th, we can look into... I don't know offhand if the state's ever done that. That's the first question and Matt might already
know. Yeah, I can speak to that very briefly. Obviously it's very briefly. To my knowledge, the state has never approved a waiver from RENA requirements on the basis of infrastructure Certainly we can confirm if that's possible or more accurately, if it's ever happened and bring that information forward next time. My recommendation would be to pursue it on a dual track in case it fails were that to be the wish of the council to make the request so to make the approval of the element that way if it fails we aren't caught in a period where we don't have a compliant element and run the risk of developers forcing approval of projects we won't want, and losing state grant funding.
But there's no harm in making the request certainly and staff James and I and the consultants will evaluate it more than 10 minutes to figure out if there's any legs in our assessment.
Thank you. This of course is a unique time, Kerry. We've never had so little water and never say never right?
Bill? First of all to say we've never had so little water is are you talking about the entire West United States or the Ojai Valley?
I'm saying we're in an extreme drought right now
but are you talking about the west united states are you talking about the Ojai valley we've never have less water than we have now We have
very little water.
No, you made a specific statement. We've never had less water than we have now. That is not a factual statement with respect to the Ojai Valley.
Okay, we have very little water right
now? That's a little different. Okay, a little different. I think it's important that we stay with facts because at the other point I want to make what we have to be careful of is traditionally people that are opposed to expanding affordable housing have used resource constraints as a way of opposing it without being explicitly clear as to what they're really doing. So we have to be careful about that, in my opinion. I don't want to make any inquiries until we've thoroughly discussed this.
I don't want to make any inquiries on behalf of the city until we've thoroughly discussed the implications and exactly what we're asking for. So, I think that's clear. We're only vetting internally at this point.
Yeah, we're just seeing if it's been done before there's any basis or anyway that anybody has done it. I would agree. I would say from our conversation with the state, I will say that a lot of the conversation was them making sure And I don't think it's just us, but making sure that the city really is going to try to do its fair share. You know and I think a lot of our conversation was look at our ADU numbers. Look at what the city has done proactively on this and they actually said a couple times that they were reassured based on that discussion so I do think if we just sent them an email and said can we you know can we essentially get a waiver, I think that there's a chance it would put the magnifying glass on us as well. So we would really dig into it and report back on the 28th.
Okay. Randy? Just quickly, that's the dilemma is... And it's not about water versus development. Every ADU is using more water It's that simple. So every time we try to tackle one challenge, we're going to face some issues on the other side of it. So I think everything has to be looked at piece by piece and project by project and house-by-house and ADU by ADU. It's not as simple as it sounds. While I'm in agreement that we're definitely challenged for water, we're also challenged for low income housing So somewhere in there, we've got to come to some realization as to what's the priority for this community and balance it. And that's what we're elected for.
To have those discussions and to have those interactions and to create that environment. So I look forward to it.
Any other
comments?
Okay so do we need a motion here or?
It's returning on September 28th already, so we'll bring it back. And if anybody does want to submit any questions or comments to us you can do so and we'll try to make sure to look at all those as well.
Wasn't this file and receive?
Yeah. You can submit comments.
Yes.
I can do
that. There was also like an 18-month process with SCAG and all these other organizations that had comment periods, and City of Ojai never brought any of this up or asked to opt out for any of the A plethora of opportunities that would have. So this process, this isn't something that happens lightly they have to redevelop an entire mechanism for how they count all this stuff it goes through multiple committees. I just want to say the opportunity if the city wanted to hop out of this if you're paying attention was a long time ago
4:38 – 4:4419 turns
Mayor, just one last thought on that too is it I forgot to bring it up. There's a major lawsuit by the Orange County against SCAG about their rain in numbers and and that's still being played out. I don't know how that's going to impact the rest of Southern California but they're not happy with what was given them so Matt is that something that we should think about be aware of or just be updated on?
Just to be updated on the Orange County lawsuit, because our number is so small relative to the 1.4 million units across SCAG that it's unlikely to have any significant effect on our 53 unit allocation. So we're aware of it and we're monitoring And they have a somewhat limited chance of success. Nonetheless, if they win, they win and if they do win that will reallocate the numbers across the rest of SCAG but we wouldn't expect a significant increase again given that percentage 53 out of 1.4 million And as noted by Mr. Vega earlier, the city did secure a significantly reduced number through participating in that 18-month long process not zero but significantly reduced by a factor of what seven from the prior number
I agree with you, Matt. But at any point in that process to the city ever object to having any number whatsoever due to water shortages or other resource infrastructure lacking or anything like that? No, it argued a reduced number for a bunch of different reasons but not that and It's just that, I mean we were talking about this earlier. We're sending the staff on an opportunity to go ask these agencies on how to opt out of this which i think anybody who's actually been involved in this and been on VCOG and dealt with SCAG a bit of the meetings that there's no chance they're going to let us opt out of it They've reduced our numbers substantially because at the time we could reduce it. We went through a process to do that, we got it reduced sevenfold.
We should be happy with it. I don't know why would go back and complain about it now? It's gonna send the wrong message. We got a huge W in the column for getting that number reduced down to where it is. Now we wanna take another bite of the apple way after it was already decided just sounds like Sounds like we're wasting time, which is kind of the issue why we brought up before. And I don't even think we voted on it feels like this just got unilaterally pushed through and my vote is that no you guys shouldn't waste your time asking to get it reduced to zero. I know it's not going to happen.
I've been in the meetings where they have made it real clear so now I appreciate me great if it was zero but I also think Randy's right This council has got to decide whether we're really against affordable housing so much that we're going to waste staff time, not to try and find a way to do it right. But to try and eliminate the number even though we apparently still say we want to do
it. I think we're better off just having really good gray water systems and with the accessory dwelling units also means people doing home shares which doesn't necessarily have to increase the amount of water And
there's always a first. So are we going to wait and bring this back? That's what we're doing right now? Yep, okay. All right so we'll move on to council member reports. Anybody?
I'll pass under the circumstances except our next meeting will be, I believe at 6.30 for consent items and it will be at Libby Bowl again so we'll see everybody in two weeks.
Any future agenda items?
We're bringing the housing element back. We'll probably be bringing back the BAP fire hardening at that meeting as well and then we have a couple others that we're trying to schedule either for that meeting or the next but those will be the two major ones
Well, homes and fire. So that's good. Randy?
We're on future agenda, right? Yeah. I'd like a budget update. Think we haven't had one in awhile. Nice to get some type of readout. And I just want to say, I appreciate the conversation tonight regarding protocols and I'm not going to let them go If I feel the same way again, I'll do the same thing again. I'm just asking council to think about what we do and how we do it and how we can do it better.
Agreed you can always get better. Okay anything else? All right thank you all real
quick mayor yeah when we bring back the BAB would it be Appropriate to wrap in, maybe the updated draft. We provided feedback on the disaster plan and I don't know if we've seen an update, updated draft or not? Or maybe I'm not thinking clearly because it's too late at night. Would it be appropriate to wrap that into that agenda item as
well? So I thought that council ended up You're right, it's late. But I think Council approved the resiliency framework With that 14th item added, which was
a couple little changes.
Yeah but I think it was approved so i believe that's been approved.
It's not an issue of any discussion any further discussion right now? Okay
well we want to bring back as a funding plan are you know identifying which will require funding and then potential options so
that is okay. Mayor I apologize for bringing up please focus on the BAB recs
And Patrick Maynard, I talked to him and he's going to come at the end of October to talk about his relationship with us and how we're going to coordinate. So that'll be great. All right well thank you all have a good night sleep and this meeting is adjourned.