UnGovr Transcript
iHow this transcript is madeUnGovr transcribes the official recording with automated speech-to-text, separates speakers by voice, and matches voices to the seated roster. Names and attributions are AI estimates and may contain errors.Verify any quote yourself: click anywhere in the transcript and the official video jumps to that exact moment, so you can check any quote against the recording.Scheduled start 6:00 PM · clock-time estimates pending review
0:00 – 0:0616 turns
Yes mayor. Mayor Stix.
Here.
Mayor Pro Tem Whitman.
Here.
Council Member Ruhl.
Here
Council Member Lange.
Here
council member Francina
here
all present
Agenda Discussionitems moved / continued / pulled — click to expand
commission reports and no presentations. So we will go on to public communication And just a reminder to everyone, these are items that are not on the agenda. And because they're not on the agenda we cannot discuss them. We appreciate your viewpoint and participation and we can agendize them for the future. So we'll begin with Ula Levitt and then Ariana Macias. I said that wrong didn't I? Macias, okay. And Alula Alderson.
I'm a senior at Oak Grove School and have lived in Ojai my whole life. I am also member of the Ojai Mayor's Youth Council. I am here to talk about the plastic problem in Ojai. Plastics have been shown to be in our water supply are a hazard, and if we do not act now it will only get worse. It came to my attention that in 2014, the City of Ojai passed the Ordinance No. 817 to stop single-use plastic bags in grocery stores and liquor stores.
I noticed that grocery stores are using plastic bags again. I found out that stores in Ojai are allowed to use thicker plastic bags that are at least 2 1⁄4 mils thick. I'm afraid this is a loophole that stores are using to continue providing plastic bags. They are intended to be used multiple times. Unfortunately, not many people I've noticed actually reuse a plastic bag more than once so this causes more plastic waste than before.
The extra plastic causes there to be a greater number of microplastics in our environment as they contaminate our soil water and food I would like to mention that Westridge stopped giving out plastic bags excluding meat and produce, and that seems to be working well for them. Whereas Vons continues to use thick plastic bags. This loophole is even of concern to the state.
In 2014 California as a whole also decided to transition to thicker plastic bags, and the state as well noticed a huge increase in plastic waste. In 2014, California threw away 315 million pounds of plastic bags while in 2022, California threw away 462 million pounds of plastic bags. That's a huge increase for a law that was supposed to reduce the amount of plastic in landfills.
I am urging the City Council to really take this seriously and to make others aware of this issue. Here are my three solutions that I propose. The first is for the City Council to add this to the agenda and further clarify the Ordinance 817, to include all plastic bags. The second is to investigate why stores still use thicker plastic bags and work with them to find a solution.
And lastly, anyone here that is listening in please do not use these bags bring your own paper or cloth bags. I'm very passionate about this and am asking the City Council to put an end to this plastic bag problem once and for all. This is so important for my future and everyone else's. The environment is counting on all of us thank you
Thank you, Ula. Next we have Ariana and then Alula and then Leanna McNeely.
Hello council my name is Ariana I'm a junior at Oak Grove and i'm a member of the Mayor's Youth Council. I am urging you to stop the usage of rodenticides in Ojai. Rodenticides are being sold in local stores which give people easy access to purchase these toxic chemicals These easily attainable chemicals make their way into the raptor population which threatens the ecosystem. According to the Ojai Raptor Center, rodenticides have been a detrimental impact on raptors.
Rodenticides are poison that do not kill animals immediately rather it makes them weak and slow before they die which makes them easy prey. A family of barn owls are approximately six, which can consume up to 4,000 rodents in the span of their four-month breeding cycle. In efforts to solve a rodent population in the Nordoff bleachers, The Green Valley Project was able to install two owl boxes and help raise awareness of the positive impact they could have on their campus.
Also, in many instances our pets are also being affected by the infected rodents which can induce vomiting and diarrhea. This puts in risk their well-being and safety. We must be able to solve this problem and protect our natural ecosystem. So here are some things I propose. We must help support the health of our raptors and use our local resource or natural resources to help maintain a healthy wildlife cycle because raptors are nature's rodenticides.
This will also help maintain a balance within the rodent population. Another solution for public areas is that the council must pass a mandate to cover the trash cans through the city with lids so that rodents don't become more populated in areas where people leave their trash. I encourage the community to also build owl boxes and pick up after themselves to stop the rodent population, and continue to encourage the well-being of our wildlife and its preservation.
Lastly, I urge the Council to ban all sales of rodenticides in the Ojai Valley because this will encourage people to look for alternatives to rodenticides. The youth cares about the environment and I care about its well-being, so I urge the council to preserve our sacred ecosystem and support the ban of rodenticides. Thank you.
Thank you, Ariana. Next we have Alula and then Leanna and then Dan McLaughlin.
0:06 – 0:114 turns
Hello, this feather belonged to an owl that died here in Ojai from consuming rodenticide. Hello my name is Alula Alderson I'm a senior at Ojai Valley School and a member of the Ojai Mayor's Youth Council today like Ariana I would like to talk to you about the use of rodenticide in the Ojai Valley which is a subject I feel passionately about as an animal lover and environmentalist Often, rodents will need to consume rodenticide multiple times before the poison takes effect as they've developed some immunity.
Not only can rodenticide be ineffective but it's also extremely inhumane. When the poison does work as intended, rodents suffer from uncontrollable internal bleeding and die an agonizing death lasting anywhere between a couple of hours to several days. During this time frame, the rodents grow lethargic becoming easy targets for raptors and other predators and once dead may be consumed by scavenger birds in this way rodenticide works its way up the food chain killing owls like this one hawks eagles snakes coyotes and mountain lions A study performed by the California Department of Fish and Wildlife found 95% of mountain lion carcasses in the state contain traces of this poison in their systems.
One of the greatest concerns of my age group is climate change. Rodenticide is a small but significant factor in this larger issue because it's responsible for great biodiversity loss. Overall, rodenticide usage is often ineffective, cruel and harmful for the environment. Recognizing this, the Ojai City Council passed a resolution 10 years ago to discourage the sale purchase and use of anticoagulant rodenticides but clearly not much has changed. Stores in Ojai including Wachter's Hay & Grain continue to sell rodenticide and residents continue to purchase and use it I urge the City Council to put this topic on the agenda for a future meeting and consider the following actions.
One, educate the community about the dangers of rodenticide. Two, encourage residents to remove rodent attractants and use traps and other devices rather than turn to rodenticide. Three, install Raptor boxes throughout the city to naturally exterminate rodents. And four, pass a new ordinance that goes one step further than discouraging rodenticide and bans it altogether. Thank you for your time.
Thank You Alula Next we have Leanna and then Dan and then Rachel Hunt
Good evening. My name is Leanna McNeely and I'm a member of Better Solutions for Ojai, which is a group of 60 plus neighbors who are affected by the encampment on the City Hall campus. We'd like to express our gratitude for the engagement with our group by Mayor Sticks, Councilwoman Sousa Franchina Chief of Police Trina Newman and Ben Harvey. The fact that you all took time from your busy schedules to meet with us shows your commitment to continued engagement.
With our new city manager, we've seen positive action in confronting Ojai's homeless issues in ways that are sensible and compassionate while the efforts made managing the encampment are appreciated those of us living in proximity to it continue to experience disruptions To the quiet enjoyment of our homes. We understand that the City Administration recognizes the current site of the encampment is not only not ideal, but highly detrimental to the surrounding neighborhoods as well as to the city employees who work next to it.
We hope that all council members also recognize this fact and we urge the Council to publicly acknowledge the negative impacts to those neighborhoods in proximity to the encampment. The 2024 point-in-time survey has been published. Ojai has seen an increase of 16 people identified as unhoused from 2023 to 2024, an increase of 42%. And we know there are many more who were not captured in that survey. Any solution for the unhoused in our valley needs to consider the increasing needs for housing and services.
We're thrilled that the encampment resolution grant has been awarded in the full amount requested. We see this money as a means to locate and procure an appropriate alternate site to the encampment, one which will better serve the campers and one which will not impact residential neighborhoods. While the search for an alternate site continues we're hopeful the city administration and council members Move forward with a detailed plan for the long-term sustainability of the housing project, as this is a need which will only increase in time. Thank you.
Thank you, Leanna. Next we have Dan McLaughlin then Rachel Hunt and then Delaney Labar.
0:11 – 0:1815 turns
Good evening, my name is Dan McLaughlin. I have a concern that I've been trying to work out for probably a year dealing with the 33 proposal that you're looking at for going out for contract There's a section of the road that I came in roughly nine months ago and talked to Public Works It deals with
point-of-order man. That's
what a group is
just I'm sorry Dan. That's on the agenda tonight
It's I'm not talking about things around it's just a part of the roadway Not the contract
Okay
Okay, hopefully I'll be done anyway So I came in today and talked to Public Works staff And they said you the project is a done deal which I can't understand. You have to go to the city manager I said well he's probably got a lot on his plate He's not gonna want to be too concerned with this But it's the facilities the Clinicus and Swanner group and medical facilities and all the retail Crocker Bank or Chase Bank excuse me It's a double yellow line from Cabrillo
I think this is actually on the ATP. Can you wait? It's on its agenda.
I can't have another meeting. Okay, so
I'm sorry
Anyways something somebody should look at
because you can send us a letter also Okay. Thank you next we have Rachel Hunt Delaney LaBar and then Starchild Okay Thanks Delaney
Good evening. As someone who lives down the block from the Kent Hall encampment, I want to give a shout out of congratulations to the city and all the people who worked on that grant. Heck yeah. But also the efforts they've made to get people off the ground in these really cold, wet winter days. Additionally and perhaps most important is digging into a plan for a strategy for the future Ben Harvey, as Leanna mentioned, Ben Harvey and Mayor Sticks and Councilwoman Sousa and Trina Sheriff all met with us. And that really makes such a difference when you get that kind of city response so I really want to thank you for your time in meeting with us and discussing where we were on all of this.
I really think the grant will move us forward. That was no small feat, winning that. I've been in the grant world and I did some research into Dignity Moves who's the organization that's looking to do a more long-lasting project than the temporary tents out here And I think their template, yes they build row houses of modest single rooms. They have showers and bathrooms and laundry facilities and the things like that that you would want. They have security and fencing all of which are really helpful so there isn't a lot of ingress and egress all the hours of the day or night.
But equally as important are the social services and mental health services that they bring to the community so that you can really start to build something and help people get up and out into more permanent housing. So I just want to say, um, I know other sites will be considered. I'm eager to hear what comes next. I am patient enough to wait and see what you can do here.
And kudos to everyone and thank you keep up the good work.
Thank You Delaney. Next we have Rachel Hunt and then Starchild and then David Chapman
Hi, I'm Rachel Hunt and I am speaking to you as a lifelong community member here, third generation. And also a member of the Cherokee Nation and granddaughter of a woman named Nanihi who is one of the daughters of the American Revolution. So first off, I want to say that I'm really thankful to Jennifer Harkey from the Ventura Continuum of Care and all the work she put towards with this grant.
And I'm thankful that even if the smallest percentage of it is used for another toilet which is needed, that's a celebration. But I'm here to make a semi-proposal to have something agendized, I think it's called. So I'm proposing for $7 million of the grant to be allocated for a beloved Ojai Beloved Elder Women and Children Tiny Home Village. This would be a project of profound compassion that would offer a healthy stable living space for families to be able to stay together and individuals to continue on with community connections already established such as work or finishing school.
In an integrated system where the younger women could help take care of the aging elders who are going to need daily care support as they age and already are. The elders can act as surrogate grandparents to the children around or for their biological grandchildren that are currently facing being unhoused in the next month, and we could all care for the native plants growing food for us and a greater community in a holistic regenerative model.
This would be a long-term solution for part of our current encampment that would also create a space for women to heal from CPTSD and generational trauma that frequently comes with growing up living in poverty, and provide some protections from vulnerable women at risk of trafficking, drug exposure, and other compromising situations living on the streets put women and children in.
Furthermore, this would be a gesture of reconciliation and retribution with respect toward that this city has made a profit off of removing indigenous people from their homelands and stopping more current indigenous people from having to be continually relocated like my Cherokee ancestors were in the Indian Removal Act on the Trail of Tears to Oklahoma and into reservations.
Thank you.
0:18 – 0:235 turns
Thank you Rachel. Next we have Starchild, then David Chapman and then Anita Cram.
Hello good evening I want to speak a little bit about the last City Council meeting. I like Susie Francino was very affected by the meeting and I just wanted to explain a little bit my emotions around it The first thing I want to say is that I was very grateful for Ben Harvey, for his words of calm and reconciliation. I think one of the best things that this council did was to appoint Mr. Harvey as city manager and you did that all together and I commend you for it.
I remember before his words there, the mayor gave an explanation of why she didn't want to meet with the planning commission nomination committee of Councilmember Rule and Chair Quillacy. And that explanation really affected me, not only because I felt a lot of empathy for Councilmember Rule but also I felt a bit of disenfranchisement myself. And I just wanted to explain why.
When I rewatched the Mayor's words about Councilmember Rule, I thought if she would ever want to list all of the faults that I have, she would have to call a special meeting because in order to finish before midnight it would probably take that long. The mayor did list out about a minute of some of the faults that Leslie Rule has. And I just wanted to supplement them with some of the opinions and things I noticed about her.
Leslie Rule's been my council member ever since I moved to Ojai, and I first talked to her in opposition to the ceasefire resolution. We started out actually in disagreement about something And I found that she listened empathetically, responded to my emails and I felt very well heard and very well represented by her. Two things that I notice about her is her courage and also her integrity. And I think if the mayor and everybody can remember some of the best things about the people we work with, it makes it a lot easier to work with them. It makes it a lot easier to unite this city, heal some of the divides.
To represent the whole city because as a constituent of Leslie rules district if Leslie's not part of the Commission planning commission selection group Then I can't be represented and I think that Part of giving this city the government that we deserve is making sure that we're all represented And I urge the mayor and council to work with unity and to keep that in mind going forward Thank you.
Thank you, Starchild. Next we have David Chapman and then Anita Cramm.
Hello Council. David Chapman. I live on South Blanche just down the road and am part of Better Solutions for Ojai Group. Thank you Mayor and Council and administrative staff for all your ongoing efforts for the homeless encampment here at City Hall. I and Better Solutions for Ojai were very pleased to hear that the encampment resolution funding program grant was successful, and the city was awarded the full amount applied for. Well done, including the four cents!
Thanks also due to Ventura County's Jennifer Harkley, who wrote and put together the grant. This grant sets the stage for the completion of a temporary unhoused encampment project outside and provides future funding for the permanent supportive housing units along with full support services as specified in the grant I and my group support the search for a more suitable site that better meets the needs of the unhoused, and is located away from residential neighbourhoods.
We look forward to the restoration of the green areas once all campers have been moved into the city provided tents. On another note, the Supreme Court's oral arguments on the Grant Pass versus Johnson yesterday reflected on the complexity of the homelessness in our country. While many towns and cities have a much larger challenge than Ojai does we here have the opportunity to provide an acceptable managed solution that provides permanent shelter safety and support services for our unhoused community in a location that does not impact neighborhoods. Thank you.
Thank you, David. Next we have Anita Cram
0:23 – 0:387 turns
Good evening, everyone. Tonight I am here on behalf of the earth. As you know yesterday was Earth Day and I would like to remind all of us here in Ojai where we live on the edge of wilderness it surrounds us as a town we are wildlife corridor mountain lions have roamed this landscape for over six million years The pigeons, the scrub jays, woodpeckers, hummingbirds, flycatchers, vultures and our lizard friends date back to the days of the dinosaurs.
Living relics surviving for millions of years. It's not about the notion of us sharing the landscape with them it is the fact that they are sharing it with us We are in a wildlife interface every day. An ancient web of life that is really hard to fathom when you pause for a moment to think deeply about our presence in this delicate work of art. The earth is abundant, it's verdant, its teeming with life. Don't let anybody tell you that anything other than that is abundance. It's not about money, it' s not about houses, it''s not about cars, it ''s not about junk.
Too often, we humans want more than our share of what we actually need to thrive. We can be conscious stewards of the earth and I believe we're the only species who is capable of being a conscious steward of the earth. Complex ecosystems that millions of years it took to get to today. We may be the sole species that is capable of this responsibility, that needs to be taken with utmost seriousness. We are close to messing this up for all of the life that lives with us. So ask yourself when is enough enough? Why do you always need more?
How about just reveling in the beauty of nature and everything that is around us, and taking care of our community members? Why is it so important to monetize housing, food? These are things that people should just be able to have. It's not a lot to ask. Money doesn't buy happiness, we've heard that a lot but it's quite true. It only feeds a need for more so please I believe in Ojai. I believe in our community. I believe we're capable of this let's honor the wildlife that we live with and the earth thank you.
Thank You Anita any comments online?
We have no comments online Mayor
All right, thank you. Well we will move on to the consent calendar. I would like to pull item i and put it at the end of the agenda. I know that we have a very packed agenda and we need to keep moving and a lot of the items are time sensitive. Anybody else? No? Okay is there a motion to approve consent? I'll
make a motion to approve that we pull item i and approve the rest. Second?
I'll second it. Okay, wonderful. All right we will move on to discussion item number two Five-year proposed capital improvement program and we have a staff report Yes Thank you
Next slide please Let's see There we go. So so I'm going to start here and tonight, I am going to take you on a journey of knowledge and everything that about capital improvement programs. And they're going to define it for you. I'm going to tell you how we arrive at projects. And this is this is a Q&A too. I would welcome any questions along the way. I don't expect you to ask the questions at the end or hold your questions. So feel free to jump in if you have any questions So you have in your packet tonight, you have a colorful table and that is just a summary. We also have which I didn't include because I didn't want to overwhelm you with information right now although it's available actually I have some copies back here but The summary sheet that you have includes all of the projects in our, the city's five-year plan.
So it's year one starting July 1st and going the next four years after that so the costs are there at the projects are there and the timing Year one of this plan, there's been a lot of discussion in the industry about whether or not a CIP is a planning document or budget document. Well year one of the CIP is the basis for the budget so without any revisions to it tonight but I would welcome any suggestions, revisions questions etc that will become year one of the budget for the capital improvement program So what is a CIP project, people ask all the time. It's quite simply it builds, next slide please.
It builds, improves or preserves a city asset, a fixed asset. So in the past, you've seen in the CIP there have been capital purchases but not necessarily a capital project. Those are now being removed and putting into a different area in the budget. So I just want you to know that you might see something or not see some things that you're used to seeing, for example of vehicle purchase. And we'll talk about those later.
The other criteria is generally the cost, the value it's usually In excess of $50,000. You will see a couple of projects in here that are under because they meet the first definition there. They're building improving or preserving a city fixed asset. So the way staff and this is also a draft document just so you know but so the way that The staff puts together this document, this program. We first look at health and safety. Those are the first things that that we try to take care of in this in this plan.
We also look at city council goals and objectives and direction those come into play and asset preservation and extension of life useful life for example roadways etc.. We look at regulatory requirements And new or expanded services. And we see that going on right now, you know, we're talking tonight about this unhoused project. That's a new expanded services that we're creating for the city.
So one next slide please. So an overview of this program that you are seeing tonight and if I start seeing glazed eyes all kind of talk even faster and again feel free to jump in if I'm moving too quickly But in this document, we are looking at the first year is an eight or the first year that has twenty five projects and to the tune of about eight million dollars. That's before the unhoused project. So now you can add another 13 million to that figure. This was put this slideshow together before we got the grant. So here we are.
And same thing with so the total five years is about 63 projects and about 30 million, about 40 43 now So we have 16 new projects and we go back to the prior slide and that is staff has looked at some of the facilities that need upgrades. Next slide. Stay there. So we've looked at some some projects out there in the city, in the community, and we have added 16 new projects that you've never seen before. So they weren't in last year's CIP or prior years. We have 16 projects that are in closeout and how we define a closeout in this program It's either a project we've completed this year or a project that we are due to complete before the end of the fiscal year, the current year. So before June 30th. So there's still some underway.
Susan, the bus shelter is one of them. It will be in a closeout phase because we expect it to be done so and there's seven projects that we just continue to work on questions. No question. Next slide please. So the CIP implementation, so we are here and we are now. We are at the City Council review of the five-year CIP. This document will be adopted. It is a document and it's also a budget document. It will be adopted with the budget in June.
We are continuing to work on these projects that are underway. We're in the process of designing our next paving project. An unhoused project here very quickly, and we are working on thinking about beginning to think about projects that are in year one. So that's starting July 1st. So we are beginning to think about them and how we move forward with them, how we scope them, et cetera.
And then the next year process this process starts all over again next February. So we've been working on this since February of this year. And here we are. So next slide, please. So this slide here, there's a lot going on here. But what what I hear a lot when I'm out in the community and talking to people, I'm hearing a lot of people saying, is there anything going on with pickleball courts? And I'm like, there is a lot going on with pickleball courts. But if you look at this life cycle of a sample project, you can see the red arrow, the construction arrow, which is five arrows down. So all of that work that happens before that is something people don't see. Nobody sees that. They don't see that we've put an RFQ out for design services and start this design process.
Then, we go into a preliminary design process, and that is including any studies we may need to do, alternatives, cost estimates, etc., and we kind of You know, take a lot of time there because there's a lot of people who have a lot of opinions on what something should be. And so we're looking at all of those alternatives then we move into and I've got a little timeline along the bottom too and that's a range. I kind of got a little granular there but it's a broad range Then we move into a final design, and this is where sometimes we take a lot of time. We've got to negotiate land use agreements or right-of-way issues, things like that. We're getting permits. We're putting together a bid packet. We are looking at environmental issues, nesting birds, archaeological concerns so you can see How this all takes a lot of time and it really does.
It's unusual for a capital project from, and you see my little light bulb up there? It all starts right there with an idea. Somebody's got an idea. So from idea to final completion, it's rarely under a year. It very rarely under a year. So we're moving very quickly on Pickleball because Because we are, because we have to. We have to and so where we had this in the final design there we were working with the County of Ventura on right-of-way in this case it was a land use agreement and that was two parties that were working very well together and in conjunction we all had the same goal A lot of times it's not like that, and we've seen that in phase two of the ATP project. We are challenged with right-of-way issues there right now. And so you can sometimes get stuck in any one of these places and they just take time.
It's just that simple. And it's reasonable to expect any capital project to be out to bid for four to eight weeks. You know, that's not unusual. We want to get as many bidders in as we can. People come from far away sometimes to work on projects here in Ojai and we like to give them time. There's a lot of questions sometimes based on the plans. And then we launch into something people can actually see.
six to 12 months before we see groundbreaking and before people actually see something happening. So that can be frustrating for you, I'm sure because people are wondering what's going on? Well, this is the very reason that we start our paving project. We are underway. We were in design on next year's paving before last year's paving wrapped up because it takes a year. It just takes that long.
So you get through the construction and then you have this closeout period, which is fairly quickly. The yellow diagonals up on top indicate about how many times you see it and make a decision on it. That's about the minimum eight times for a capital project in all of these different phases. And then there's oftentimes study sessions because we're talking about alternatives. We're talking about other things But so there you see it, and that's what takes so long.
All of that. So any questions on this? I know there's a lot going on on this slide but I thought it was important to spend a few moments and discuss really what it looks like.
0:38 – 0:498 turns
So things like more benches around the city are
part of this. Yes, and that's an excellent question. We hope that we have a design for a bus shelter that we can work with and apply in other locations. The question is and something that has come up is maybe we select it. And that's that's a project that I have in here that you will see at a location TBD And one of the ideas that we have sort of thrown around staff is maybe we cover the shelter that's at the old bowling alley and improve that shelter.
That's on private property, so we would be negotiating with the owner of the bowling alley, the old bowling alley to see if we can get an easement like we did at Bank of America or other options. But most of the bus shelters would be they're not in our public right-of-way So we would have to be working with some property owner. So on that project, the design on that project could be squished because we already have a design that we like but we may have some concerns on that final design when we start negotiating property.
And that may take time. Bank of America took a year, and Bank of America was amenable to giving that to us in an easement. It still takes time. It's back-and-forth. You know it's all kinds of things. It is working with attorneys on our side, on their side, creating legal descriptions etc.
I wasn't just thinking of the bus shelter project, which are super important and so thank you for that. But I was thinking about the need for just for pedestrians that are walking around town and some kind of—I'm sure I can get a little army of volunteers to walk the town and see where they could be located. But I just want to make sure that what I call people parking stays part of that project, but it stays part of the future plan.
And we can certainly talk about that. I mean, we can add new projects throughout the course of the year if you know if if the council so wishes and this is This document also, it's a snapshot in time. Yes, it's right now things can move. Things can be added. Things can be delayed. Deleted projects can shift from year to year. It's a it's living breathing document again. It just snapshot in time. That's all it is. Yeah. No, this looks great. Thank you. Sure. Thank you. Next slide please.
So with that prior slide in mind, I wanted to highlight a couple of projects. We are about to embark on some of the largest in scope and dollar amount projects that this city has ever seen. We really, truly are. They're multi-year and they're very costly so and not to say we're not going to do them but I just wanted to sort of highlight them for you. We've got some storm drain projects and I've mentioned this to you as well in the past. We have to...we really have to start looking at our storm drain system.
We had a, we, Casitas had a water break up on Signal not too long ago that wreaked havoc. I was out of the country that weekend coincidentally but our storm drains are about that age they're about 60 years old and they are well beyond their useful life so you will see in this document as well as in the budget I am recommending that the city embark on A multi-year project. Number one, we would start with a study, a master drainage study identifying areas that need repairing, need improving, enlarging, increasing size whatever the case may be So we, we do a study up front. It's not unlike our pavement management plan that identifies streets that need repairs and then we program money in the budget in the coming years and kind of bite off chunks of that We would do the same thing in the storm drain system so you'll see that over a five-year period So we would propose for year one, a study and then the next four years out improvements based on the results of that study.
So it becomes a multi-year paving projects were well underway. We're moving along every year and I expect that to continue in perpetuity because Once we get all the streets done, we just start over and the treatment stays the same. I mean, the treatment is different. We're not rebuilding streets potentially but we're maintaining them now. We move more into a maintenance period which is good. It's a good thing.
We've got the ATP project which is on the agenda this evening as well that Well, in all likelihood be a multi-year project. And we've got our new unhoused housing project that will be a very ambitious project. They all are. I mean, we have an ambitious CIP. Next slide, please. So I wanted these are these slides, and I don't need to go through every single one of them more than anything. I wanted to illustrate these are projects that we've done this year. We have completed this year or due for completion this year . So, of course, the paving the parking lots you have not seen those yet. We're out to bid right now. We are hoping to repave Rainbow Bridge in the plaza parking lots in these fall under those That criteria of health and safety, they've become unsafe.
And so we are trying to get those moving along at this point. We have trip and falls and they're just in poor shape. So on, we've done the gym floor this year, backup batteries, ball fields, Middle Stewart Canyon right down here is finishing up this year. Our grant that we got for that has finally finished. So we're done and we will be restoring here before long We're painting. So you see a little asterisk here on the painting of the arcade, so we are on deck staff is on deck to do that paint the arcade refresh it and make it look nice.
I think I'm going to push that out a little bit. There's so much chaos going on out there right now that I don't think we need to create anymore. Yeah, so we may just start that after summer and move it on out a little bit. And we're installing catch basins and our trolley bus shelter. Questions? Questions? Next slide, please. So here's another sheet of closeout projects. So these projects were completed this year, but I wanted to spend a moment on this. These were in the CIP last year and that's why I'm putting them up as closeouts.
These types of projects you won't see in the CIP anymore. They're operating costs. The first two The dollar amounts are insignificant. They aren't improving a fixed asset of the city. We bought gym equipment, we put a shade structure up at the wall at the skate park and the truck purchase. Those were in the CIP in the past they won't be anymore. It's the truck purchase it's a capital purchase but it's not a capital project so it goes into our vehicle replacement fund So just wanted to sort of I mean, this I'm trying to sort of explain how all of this comes about.
There were some sort of anomalies in prior year CIP's that I noticed. And so we're trying to take baby steps and kind of move it in the right direction. So
through the mayor? A quick question, so basically what you're saying and this is what you started with is that there are projects and there are purchases. And they're not the same thing although they may have been slightly merged in the past and what you'r doing is pulling them apart and differentiating them.
That's exactly right. These types of purchases will still be made. You will see them in the operating budget. Great yeah
thank
you. Next slide please So I am only highlighting on these slides new projects, projects that have not been in the CIP before because you were all here last year for the CIP. So you know, I don't expect you to remember all of them, but but these are new projects that staff has gone out into the community and we have knew new things have come about new concepts, new so we just wanted to illustrate here. So we've got Pickleball at Seoul Park, a phase two.
Phase one is this year and we are hoping it's out to bid right now I don't know if you've all seen them seeing the plans on the website but they're out there so they're out to bid we hope to get enough bids and will open on May 1st and come back to you on May 14th and award the contract for phase one which is the courts themselves Phase two is just sort of a placeholder if we wanted to construct shade structures out there, benches. The original phase one plan has some benches but anything we think we might need after the courts open so we've got a new project.
So we have Libby Bowl improvements, TBD on the scope. Our city manager has suggested after we get through a concert year and series, we maybe make some improvements that that we think are necessary. So that's a new project. And likewise with the park, the lighting at Libby Bowl and also to help facilitate the holiday lighting is what we're really kind of looking for on that one.
City Council chambers here at Kent Hall, since meetings are now being held here. We would like to have a project and you know not we haven't really scoped it entirely yet but you know maybe some improvements here We will also be working on the bathrooms here and making them ADA compliant because we need to do that since it's now public facility, public use. At Oak Tree House which is the finance building, we are going to be retrofitting bathrooms there to provide shower facilities so city staff can shower after they've exercised at lunch. They run the bike trail and they want a shower and get back to work. So that's what we're doing there We will be installing backup batteries at the Public Works Admin Building, which is where my office is.
And just a backup battery system so if power goes down we can still work and computers are working. And then our giant project—we all know what that is—the unhoused. So that will launch very soon.
0:49 – 0:546 turns
My question is about the City Council Chambers Improvement, Kent Hall. In the beginning my understanding was that Kent Hall was going to be for really large audience meetings and it's wintertime We can't put people outside. So I don't know how my colleagues feel, but before you embark on that, I would like some kind of analysis of the two places because I never approved that I wanted to be here permanently I'm not unhappy here, but I do feel it bears some discussion before we embark on that. You know, I don't know if we need to put that on the agenda and maybe it's a seasonal thing because in the wintertime this may, maybe this makes sense, but I don' even know the number of seats we have at, in our former council chamber and here.
is moving in the direction of a permanent location.
And we can totally do that and if you go back to that busy slide where I was talking about the timeline, we would look at those things in terms of alternatives and we can do, does this room, is the capacity here greater than the capacity over at Old City Hall? And maybe we look at it if it's just a seasonal, you know, seasons. For special? Yeah. Change out the wardrobe every season, you know? Just kind of move around. Okay. So yeah and those are part of the preliminary design and the alternatives and we would be looking at that and you would see them. We would be bringing those back to you so that's all in this whole process And I saw Ben noting that down. So we will be discussing that. Next slide, please.
So these are the new projects not in year one so they're not in the budget year but they're in years two through five and I should probably say now too this is a five-year CIP but we update it every year. So every single year is a five-year. It's a rolling five years every year. We've got this first one, this is the rapid flashing beacons that I have heard people want.
We have I have been in contact with Caltrans on that and they may be amenable to installing those for us. They they want to get through the paving project as we all do want them to get through the paving project and then they will see if they have adequate funding left. And so I'm in negotiations with them right now. So that may not end up being a city project But a Caltrans project. It is along their right-of-way, so it makes sense but it's too soon to know for now.
Okay, I'm
sorry. So you're saying that if for example we've heard for years that we Desperately need the crosswalk from a coffee roasting company. Yes made safe before we have another fatality If Caltrans does not move forward in a timely fashion We could allocate and discuss or negotiate doing something ourself Is that what you're saying? Um
I am not saying that because that's already happened. It's in year two, I've already programmed it in here so if Caltrans doesn't do it then we would remove it here but we have it in our document already so we're already planning on the possibility that we were already planning on us having to do it on our own. We may not have to
Okay, okay. Yes, so but this when you I guess when you say year two that makes me feel like it's somewhere in the future instead of more
immediate It's just not next year. So year two is 2526 so we're going to be year one is fiscal year 2425 so starting July 1st of 24 ending June 30th of 25 it will be a year from this June and And we can't get in there sooner than that anyways because of the chaos going on on Ojai Avenue and the paving project that's going on. So a lot of these projects are phased and timed based on other things that are going on, so Caltrans is having, there's some challenges as we all know.
And the time period, we can't get a definitive timeframe yet when they're going to be done through town. Allegedly they're starting at out of the city and coming, they're starting in the west and going east. We have requested that they start east and go west and get through our city first. That is to be determined yet.
0:54 – 1:0928 turns
I will just ponder all that. Okay,
and
I
can restate
it?
No no no you're very
clear. Okay. I just have to think through okay because it's my way of thinking It's an urgent situation
Yes, I appreciate that
perhaps we can You know stick something in the crosswalk ourselves and take it down it whatever
so we're talking about two locations as well We're talking about both at Ojai Avenue along the arcade one at Montgomery and one across from Libby
Thank
you.
I would actually just like to reiterate that because They are both dangerous anything we can do to move that forward
And I am in contact directly with Caltrans on
I'm sure you are thank you very much I support
that as well
I do too. And I have a question, so you know we are going to be having our goals and priorities setting workshop that we postponed and one of the conversations that we were planning on having was about contracting some of the services out like the trolley and things like And so when I look at electrifying our trolleys, building charging stations. I think that's really important given where all the health and safety, all the climate, everything about that. So if we were to move toward contracting those services out, would that potentially speed up the timeline for building those facilities or having an electrical trolley fleet?
So there are some challenges, and we've spoken about this before in terms of receiving an electric trolley. And in speaking with a Gold Coast who would be our option to we would contract with they they are 24 months from the day they order a trolley to getting an electric one. So it's 20. It's two years. So that's the reason this this trolley The EV charging is in year three because if we were to order one Say in the next six to eight months. We're not going to get it for two years So again, this is a rolling plan And if we get any additional updates or if the move is to try to move quicker If there's you know options we would do that and we would bring it back to you and say hey We're gonna move this into year two And we would probably it's hard, obviously.
It's harder to predict what goes on in years two, three, four and five rather than the current year or next year. So it's a moving it's a moving target. And we are fully aware of the council's goals and we're trying to hit those marks. And technology hasn't necessarily cooperated 100 percent on that. So lots of people, lots of agencies are trying to electrify Lots of lots of people on the list and a couple years out.
So we've already installed HVAC at Oak Tree House is another is another one that's at the finance building, so we'll be electrifying where we can and when we can. So in the trolley shelter, we've already talked about another one potentially. So good questions.
I actually have another question too. And this is, first of all, Lindy, I cannot tell you enough how grateful I am for you and your leadership and just all of like how well you've organized this. You're really, you've done an incredible job so thank you. I have a question. In hearing information from the California League of Cities and hearing what other cities are facing, it's really clear that we have to be preparing for rising temperatures and for some of the effects of climate change.
And so things like planting shade trees, making sure that five years from now, ten years from now we have done everything we can to mitigate the effects of climate in addition to reducing our imprint. Would things like shade trees or, I love the shelters. I think that falls under this category but would planting trees be a part of this project or would that be in a different category?
So in the past we have had a climate mitigation section in our CIP And we budgeted a lot of money. You directed staff to budget a lot of money to put into climate mitigation, for example street trees etc. We have shifted that that money out of the CIP and moved it into the operating budget. And so we are actively, in fact I just walked town about let's see what is it Tuesday last week and identified some locations where there's tree wells with no trees.
And so I walked out with our inspector slash project manager and we're like, okay We're gonna we're gonna install a tree here in solitary, you know, and now it's Earth Week So we were talking about let's do this. So we have got plenty of money in our city budget to Plant trees and put them where we can and we are actively doing that. We really are Wonderful. Yeah, and also as part of that too now we have our wildfire mitigation so we're planting new trees and we're trimming old trees because it's this cycle. It really is a cycle. So we've got new trees that are growing, old trees that need trimming and thinning Thank you very much.
So here's a couple of projects that have been sitting in our CIP for some period of time, and I am recommending at this point that we remove them from the CIP. And these are conversation pieces And I will start with this multi-sport court at Sarzotti. I've had several meetings with the Parks and Rec Commissioners, the ones that are there and have been there, and this project seems to have become less of a priority. It's been in the City budget and in the City CIP since 2018.
So a very long period of time with not a lot of activity and seemingly not a lot of interest anymore. And I guess my one of my big fears on this particular project is, is we may find ourselves in a similar situation as we have seen out here at the pickleball courts in terms of the negative impacts to the neighbors. The plans that I've seen for this project It abuts the property line really between the ball fields and the property.
Night play would be allowed lit courts, and I can see that creating a problem for the neighbors. And so on another on the prior slide on a new project. So I have created another a new project, and that was that's a half court basketball court at Sarasota. that may sort of pick up a knee. And so I would recommend we remove this and the other item related to this is we have some external funding, we have some state funding and we have some Ojai Civic Association funding and I'm in communication with the state and it seems as though we may have an opportunity to shift that funding to other recreation programs that we have.
So, obvious one right now is Pickleball. And there's a real possibility we can shift some of that grant funding to Soule Park and help pay for the pickleball courts there and other improvements. I've spoken to our new recreation manager and I said let's do an all parks master plan. Let's really try to define and understand what the city's needs are for ASO playgrounds or ASO fields, ASO practice fields and other recreational needs. And he was completely on board with that. So that's something that you will see in the operating budget that there's for a master plan for all the parks. What do we really need? So we have quite a bit of funding for this multi sport court, and we can probably shift most of that over to other projects that maybe maybe have a higher priority, I guess.
And a greater need. So same thing with the water park element, there was an item in the CIP for a water park element to go along with the new playgrounds out there. We're still moving forward with the playgrounds and more of a top playground than an older children's playground. There didn't seem to be a lot of remaining interest for a water park element. So I'm just recommending we remove that.
Will an item like that go to the Recreation Commission? And my other question is, there's no question in the summer heat that we need something even if it's just like the misters in Libbey Park are super popular
in the
summer so we could and I remember suggesting this two or three years ago that we have misters in Sarzotti
You
can even point them toward the bushes, whatever.
Yeah and that's a great idea. That's just much more scaled down. They had talked about a water park element which was more like a splash pad and something like that but I am sure we could incorporate some sort of misters when we construct the new playground. And of course the Commission is an advisory committee to you and as soon as we have a commission I would love to talk to them and get their feedback. But in the absence of that, I'm coming straight to you guys. And then we've got this Bryant Industrial Area Improvement and so I talked to James Vega last year about that and it was in our CIP Um, spanning two fiscal years at two and a half million each year.
And I'm like what the heck is that? And he wasn't real sure about what the scope was. I dug a little deeper and it looks like it-it-that project was a result of Complete Streets and at some point somebody wanted to So I would recommend we remove that. It was a huge dollar amount, number one. Again, we have challenges in implementing complete streets but I will go back to a couple of previous conversations that I've had with all of you and what I would suggest is We identify a street and we build it out complete streets. And we see what it looks like, see what it feels like, see what the cost is.
It's far too expensive for complete streets to be implemented on every single street. We've got too many issues. It' too expensive. So maybe we, maybe we identify a pedestrian corridor and we begin on those streets and see how it feels. So that's what I would recommend in getting rid of this particular project. Okay. May I ask a
question? I'm sorry you're going to hear from me for the next four items. Okay so when you say Bryant industrial area improvements You know, there's a demonstration project behind Weill Academy, the so-called Complete Streets Demonstration Project. And then we've had numerous conversations because we're concerned with rebuilding Cabrillo housing and it's obvious that we are somehow Somebody, somebody there has to be some way for the people that live there to safely walk down Bryant Street. There's just no question that we have to do something appropriate It could be if we don't have the money to build sidewalks We can just reduce the speed limit to 20 and enforce it because that alone makes the street safer And if at least It's expensive after whatever studies we have to pay for.
I want to get straight what you're saying. You're recommending this be removed from the CIP, but isn't that an item that should go before the council for more discussion? Clear
it can. And that's why I put this slide up because I know that these projects and this alarming recommendation, and if there's anything that you want us to bring back for further conversation, we can certainly do that. I guess what I would say about Bryant Industrial Area, and I'm calling it because that's how it has been identified in the CIP. I guess I would recommend rescoping that If anything, because I 100% agree with what you're saying. With Cabrillo we need to have a safe pedestrian area. The problem with that is and I feel like a broken record sometimes, but we've allowed the city has allowed a lot of private improvements to be constructed in the public right-of-way. So if you look at the curb face to curb face that's a very That our right-of way goes beyond that on both sides But we don't have the ability to really improve that like we should because there's power poles There's mailboxes their stone walls.
There's all kinds of permanent structures that we have allowed over time and I'm not placing but it's just been overtime. So something on Bryant, what we may want to do is come in instead of out so and I would have to illustrate that on a sketch to show you what I'm talking about but rather than going out from the curb face which is to the extent of our right-of-way maybe we come in Just a lot of, here we go back to these alternatives. We go back to that phase of a project is these alternatives and there could be many and we present them to you and you select one.
1:09 – 1:1410 turns
So while we're on the subject if I may because right now the bike trail stops abruptly mysteriously On Bryant Street. And so the bike trail extension and Bryant Street are intimately connected, those two. And so we've got whole families wanting to go back into town. They realize they're stuck now, they gotta find Sarzotti Park, there's a sign. So somehow we have to make that safe for the families.
I don't see how we can get around that. It's a safety, it's a safety priority. Are you
talking about the end of the bike trail?
Yes Even if we extended there's gonna be a lot of people Because first of all, it's no longer just industrial We've got you know A big social scene going on with brewery and will probably have cannabis lounges and everything else in the future so Okay, so what are we... Bryant Industrial Area Improvements. You're talking about bicycle and pedestrian safety improvements? And
everything else? Well I'm not talking about anything because I don't really know what the scope of that project ever really was. I've gone to Complete Streets, the document and I see Bryant out there as one of the streets that has been looked at. And so yes, there's bicycle lanes et cetera but nothing's been designed. It's a concept at this point, it's just conceptual. So in order to do any improvements out there we would create a project, I would recommend anyways, we create a project Maybe, maybe at the time we pave Bryant. You know that? That's and if you look at that and I will come back to this but you see the next one Grand Avenue bike lanes that should not be a standalone project that will be done when we pave grand.
You know, we will attempt to do what we can do but we've also talked about Cheryl's there which are no good. But so if we wanted to look at a project on Bryant to create pedestrian Thank you.
Suggest on this one, as we remember back to Lindy's slide about the process of a CIP project, there was that alternatives and design discussion. This is that discussion that we should have when it's straight up on the agenda. Bryant streets, pedestrian and bicycle safety improvements. And so staff recommendation at this time is to delete the unscoped unplanned $5 million line item that's just Bryant area industrial improvements. Delete that from the CIP and replace it with a coming discussion on what makes sense and what scope and level of improvements for the Bryant Avenue in the Bryant Circle, looking at the bike trail connection, looking at the pedestrian connections between Cabrillo and the north end of the south.
And looking at sort of it as a full scope. So that's the recommendation this time on that one.
And if I could also just quickly chime in, I know our community development director has been working with the developer on some things behind the scenes about making connections to Ojai Avenue and the trail and so forth. So there will be more on that but absolutely. There he is.
Here he is!
Mr. Siebert do you want to speak on that really quickly?
30 seconds. If this council remembers back in December of last year one of the conditions as a part of the Cabrillo project, that 50 unit project at three-story project Talked about having a conversation looking at grants, working through the county or through the state. We've been navigating that course right now. I don't know that I really have explained that to Lindy at this point but that's one of the pieces we're looking at it's extending beyond their boundaries. Their boundaries are the requirement that they have and that's something that we're working through right now But the trail up to OI Avenue, those are much bigger projects and certainly something that needs a lot more thoughtful consideration.
Thank you very much.
1:14 – 1:2416 turns
Oak Street down, you know because there are other options Would that be? Part of I mean are we thinking a complete street project or are we going to and this could be yet to be decided You know Targeting Bryant and then targeting sort of the downtown corridor for you know biking and walking Because That seems to me it also be something that really fits in
That would be my vision. I think that would be a really good goal. We've been so proactive over the last year or so, that I can speak of anyways, in trying to get streets to a condition that are safe to drive and don't look potholy and all that but i think that would be a very very good project we identify And I think that's a very, very good vision.
Thank you. Thank you.
Yes through the mayor we're exploring a reciprocal use agreement I brought it up with the superintendent also Our new recreation manager wants to bring it up with his counterpart over at the school district So we will come back on that one. We'll work with the city attorney as well there's a lot of facilities and We don't have to recreate everything. We could share some things.
Okay, so I think we can say that what our city attorney stated about Bryant also applies to Grand Avenue. Yes. I mean you know those Grand Avenue bike lanes have been discussed since 1996 okay? I'm not I mean or maybe even 1994 before I was on the council in 1996 because Yeah, it was discussed. So you're not for the public looking at this slide if they're just looking at it we're not saying remove Grand Avenue bike lanes. We're saying that it's going to go somewhere else as part of a We're not removing the concept.
Grand Avenue is major bike corridor to all those neighborhoods, all the kids going down Grand Avenue and I led bike trains there and we needed four police escorts for the kids to safely get to Topatopa and that is unacceptable.
And I totally agree. The challenges on Grand is that it's a race, it's a speedway. There are no stop signs. It's a nice straight section for a very long time and so maybe we look at a parallel street as the major walking pedestrian or cycling street I think this is, and as Matt said we're only removing this unscoped project to the you know these are unscoped. We're not saying abandon the goals at all. We're not saying that at all. These are good things they just need to be scoped and they need to find a different place in our plan.
So, I found all my copies of the 2016 Complete Streets Plan. That was the reinvention of the original 1998 Bicycle Pedestrian Master Plan that I could never get three votes to implement and now we have a different council and a different consciousness and we're in the midst of climate change so even if you when you I agree that we might need to begin with some kind of, you know, alternative routes or whatever. But in truth and reality any street where people live, where children are playing and walking our goal as a small town should be every single street in Ojai with housing should be safe And for people to comfortably walk without worrying if somebody's gonna kill them. And we just had another accident on the corner of Grand and Mercer, so everybody's talking about increased accidents and how it used to be.
So we have to look at the reality that it's unacceptable for Grand Avenue to remain a speedway. I know it has some kind of label, but is it a thoroughfare? But it's still a residential street As important as those side streets If
I could just jump in really so, I think your concerns councilmember are going to be addressed through enforcement and That's that's a separate discussion Well, yes but I think what so what we're talking about is kind of a combination. What you're seeing successful cities do in this area is like what Miss Palmer is suggesting. You identify a non-arterial and you create an east west and a north south pathway that's like a bike and or pedestrian boulevard. And that's how you start it. So what you don't do is you don''t try to tackle every single street because you just don't have the resources for the bandwidth to do it.
It's an evolution in a training process so that the community and the public begins to understand, oh if I'm gonna be on my bike, I don't go on Grand if I'm going this direction. I go on this street because it's a better route to go but on top of that what we'd also like to suggest as part of the budget and I've been talking to the chief about this is a motor officer either on a part-time or a full time basis because I really think part of our issue is we're just not doing enough traffic enforcement because we're not dedicating the resources towards it
But I beg to differ because I've been at this for a long time, about 25 years. And it is completely unacceptable to my way of thinking that the Grand Avenue at this point in time still has not been redesigned, restriped. You know, our favorite character Bob Daddy and I we've been advocating this. We've stood on that corner. We've done traffic counts. We submitted analysis of the complete streets people. So I guess
if I could just interrupt really quick. I'm sorry. This is so
ulterior. OK, I'll leave it alone. But just in my opinion, even though Grand Avenue isn't ulterior Arterial Street, it's not like we have all these other arterial streets. We only have Grand Avenue and Ojai Avenue really because those other streets don't go all the way through And people are riding their bike down Grand to go to the East End. They don't want a zigzag. We
do have a packed agenda and these are time sensitive items so... The 30-year
challenge won't be solved
in one moment. Right, and we will agendize that in the future.
I just want to make sure you don't forget. Thank you. Thank you for tolerating me.
I'm going to go down to the second from the bottom, the bike trail bridge at Fox Canyon. So the County of Ventura is going to be repaving the bike trail from Ventura to the end And I have walked that area. This is a project, again, that's been on the city's books for a number of years, unfunded really or underfunded for sure. And and so I walked it with with the deputy director of parks at the county of Ventura, and he said he would definitely take a look at that.
And they're in the design stages as well. So he said he would look at that and try to come up with an alternative And something that would make it safer. That's an unsafe bridge on a bike trail absolutely really is and so he and I actually walked it He took pictures, and so they're on that so that's why I'm recommending that one remove Speed survey, we're going to come at some of these speed issues with new signage and with reinforcement or enforcement of the speed limits right now. So that would also just be an operating expense anyway so it doesn't belong in the CIP.
1:24 – 1:299 turns
Yes, thank you. A question about the speed survey is that that is a separate issue from the drowned speed study? Is that correct? We're talking about two different things?
This is a general holding place for a speed survey but it's separate. Thank you.
So one of the items that will sooner or later be on the agenda is the 25 mile per hour citywide speed limit. In some places 20 miles, in some places like the Arbolada even 15 then people will cut stop using it as a rat runner. So that we're not working at cross purposes. Are you going to hire? Is that already a done deal, that we're hiring somebody to do it? It's just gonna be removed and placed somewhere more logical and practical.
Well, our suggestion is actually a little different. We're suggesting that we think of more...we know that there are concerns about the speed limit and you know a part of the solution could be having a uniform speed limit throughout town. You'd want to have a traffic engineer and your law enforcement folks involved with that of course But rather than embarking upon an effort to do speed studies all over the place that are gonna come back and tell you that you've got some people that are exceeding the speed limit.
We know that, right? So we think that a better approach would be allocating resources towards either a portion or all of a motorcycle officer to write tickets and citations to slow people down. That's our suggestion. And we're gonna be coming back to you with that in the proposed budget. You don't have to include that in the budget, you can throw it out.
Well, we're going to need that whether we need change the speed limit or not. So I approve of that.
Right? I guess what I'm saying is we don't think a speed survey is a good use of your money. We think the better use of your money is a cop.
I agree. Thank you. OK. Yeah. And the other concerns with when we're doing these random speed surveys all throughout the city then a traffic engineer comes back with recommendations or alternatives and then we're faced with implementing those Every single different location and it becomes cost-prohibitive. Thank you, okay next slide please So these are and we've sort of I've sort of alluded to some of these already but there are some items that you have seen, some projects that you've seen in the CIPs in the past. And here's just a sampling of them. These are not being removed from the CIP. These are being moved from the CIP into other cost centers. So miscellaneous concrete repairs, this is if we go out and we see a street tree that has uplifted a sidewalk.
We have this in our operating budget. Bike lane striping, this is going to be as part of our paving projects. Same thing with implementing facilities, ADA. You're seeing a lot of new ramps being installed. All of our master plans we've got a storm drain master plan and we've got our all parks master plan those are not projects per se those are professional services that would be moved into the operating budget vehicle purchases would go into the capital purchases so you won't see these in the CIP anymore So, but they're all getting done still. They're just not in this plan.
Next slide please. So the next steps we've come to a conclusion here of this presentation but the next steps are looking for feedback from all of you if you have any staff would go back and make those revisions to this document it would be included with the budget for adoption in June along with the budget Next slide. Next slide. There you go.
All right before we take public comment any questions from council? I do have a, in terms of, Lindero first of all this was amazing. Thank you so much. So thorough and so exciting, all these new projects. Really grateful yes. In terms of replacing roofs, I've heard that it saves money if you put solar panels in when you replace them. Would that be
possible? You know what, you will see. For all of you to take home with you Each of these projects that you see has a detail sheet, a detail sheet with the project location and with a description and an objective. And so you will see that we are replacing roofs and we are putting solar panels in and I've worked with our expert who's standing up there in the back. I had him show up tonight, so we are timing a new roof replacement with the solar panel. So that's what we're already doing and you'll see that in these detail sheets.
1:29 – 1:3826 turns
Excellent.
Thank you comes from relaying
so just just Just to clarify just to I'm gonna repeat Pete Baptist So am I correct in in in understanding that a lot of the climate? That a lot of climate initiatives are already packed into some of these projects and Based on the response that you just gave the mayor.
Yes, okay, and we also have a climate section
Right, correct.
Correct yes I saw that so they are they are you'll see them in a couple of different places roofing for example would show up in a facilities improvement the solar panels would show up in the climate section as a separate project but the timing has been has been worked out okay
Another question, would that also count for climate measures in our paving plan? For example, somehow there are more porous types of concrete and more porous types of asphalt that don't release as much heat. Are we looking at those measures as well?
You know, we have not necessarily looked at all of those. We are we are in such a sort of an aggressive movement right now because there's been such a delay in paving. We will begin to look at those. We will begin last year. I kind of adopted it this year. We're moving forward with we're just doing pavement. I'm expecting next year we will start really looking at how to improve rather than just, you know, triage at the moment
Okay, great. And I was happy to see the battery backup and other things that you had included already related to climate.
Any other questions?
Yeah. If I understand what we're doing, I just want to make sure that I do understand what we're doing but the CIP is just one piece of the budget that we're going to be adopting and you're introducing to us the nuts and bolts of what it is Operational budget and other things to come up with the overall
Budget
for the city
exactly. Yes, it becomes a part of the adopted budget
So we're not really doing policy tonight as much as learning about What it is that's going to go into our? budget The policy will go into that budget process that we go through. And the goals exercise that we're working on is all part Of that so what we're doing tonight is, you know, approving where we are and understanding that. We're going somewhere in the next few months that will result in a budget.
Yes, and I sort of wanted to spend some. I know we have spent quite a bit of time on this, but I know last year this didn't happen and three of you were new last year. And and I think it's important. This is where a huge chunk of the city's resources go in the next five years in the next one year. So it's sort of important for all of you to to have an understanding of projects we're working on and how we're spending our money
And I guess my final point or question is that for those in the public who are thinking, well what about this? Why aren't we addressing electrification, getting rid of fossil fuel type of activities for the city. This is not the place where we're doing that It's all it's all going to be The the opportunity for everybody to put input into the city we'd like you to see spend more time and focus on a particular project they could still do that. We're not deciding that tonight
No, we we have put in projects that relate to that goal. And we also are moving forward with electrifying our fleets as as we can. It's a challenge again. Right. And we are replacing all of our were putting in electric HVACs where we can solar panels where we can so we're we're folding that in
Thank you, Mr. Chair. Whatever, yeah thank you. But this is project based. This is a project that we're going to do that connects to that goal in a certain way correct?
Absolutely and you can see it throughout the document. You can see it throughout all of these projects. It takes in all the goals and spits out a project. You know our end house. We hear that's a goal. We know that's the goal so we're spitting out a project You know, I mean that's what it is. Paving's the goal of this city so we're producing the projects.
Right, so it takes the goals and makes a project to basically fulfill that goal. It's very specific to that end. Okay thank you.
Any other questions? Just a brief question for actually for the city manager because I get a lot of questions about the trolley and it's so visible. Could in terms of electrification, could you? And we had spoken a little bit about some grant funding.
Yes, and Ms. Palmer and I have both been involved along with the mayor in conversations with CPA, our Community Choice Aggregate JPA that we belong to. And there is funding available to help us pay for the infrastructure, the charging apparatus. It's a considerable effort to invest in that. It probably a few hundred thousand dollars to do but there is grant money to help us with that. The bigger challenge as Ms. Palmer pointed out is actually getting the vehicle delivered to you If it's the Council's desire, we could certainly put that in the next budget and start that process. But it is about a two-year effort. And just on the topic of contracting out that service, that's something that Council will decide, not staff.
But if Council does want to do that, our proposal would be that We would own the asset, and so the look and feel of the trolley would remain what we want it to be. We would have someone else operate it for us—someone with a broader bench of drivers and experience in that area. So we understand how important the trolley is to town and people who come here. We actually want to expand the trolley routes.
Carl, you may or may not know this, has received the good news that he is now in charge of the entire transit function. And he's already been very impactful. We've got another trolley that's now back in service thanks to Carl and his efforts so anyway more on that to come but we understand the importance of it. It's just a longer process.
Thank
you. And through the mayor, just a final comment that as a member of the Ventura Council of Governments every city is struggling with this. They have in fact some cities have mandates to electrify and they can't get the vehicles So it is causing every city in Ventura, this is a big conversation that happens at VCOG about the inability to actually source those. The intent is certainly there and even the money is there but the vehicle isn't there so it's something that everyone in Ventura, all cities in Ventura County are struggling with and trying to put pressure There's just huge competition for the electrified vehicles. Companies, private companies, public entities, municipal. So we have intent and hopefully supply will come about, yeah, will follow.
Okay
well we will go ahead and move on to public comment. We have Renee Roth?
1:38 – 1:4410 turns
Oh my gosh. Okay, I'm Renee Roth. I live in Ojai. I was trying to get on Zoom so I could do this at Zoom but I didn't have a connection and I didn't know who to call so I had to run down here with my cane and try to do this. So sorry but I'm here. In terms of the CIP way to go! We have a few projects defined. I'm glad to see that. I am very glad to see that.
The one thing that I noticed in a transition from the past to the current moment is James made a big deal about the gymnasium roof Now maybe it was talked about in the translation from me getting from here to there But I didn't see the gymnasium roof on this list of projects and I remember that was over a million dollar kind Of product. Oh, it's on there Okay good It's on the detail part. Okay, I looked at the staff report. I didn't see the million dollars on there and I've been looking for it because I remember the park and rec department had a five-year plan and They had a five year plan for all these amazing projects they were gonna do for The Park and Rec District and it never really went anywhere and nobody really did anything with it But I love to talk about Solar and doing roofs together at solar time and roof time.
And also, that roof is an amazing roof to capture rainwater from the roof to put into a rain garden, a rain catchment garden Some of you remember I put in Matilla Hall School Yard Habitat and one of the big roofs, one of the other big roofs in town is a Matilla Hall Gymnasium that has a huge roof. And we tried to get the school district to direct that flow of water out to a rain garden.
But they didn't choose to do that. They chose to direct the water out to some basketball courts, much to my dismay. I would like to see the city do it right this time and be able to put in rain capture, rain gardens Teach people about how to capture rainwater on city property. That park is a beautiful place and it could and should be used to demonstrate environmental projects, so thank you for all this environmental talk. Thank you.
Thank You Renee any comments
online? Oh, we have Brian Eakins.
I didn't want to miss this opportunity. So I'm here as the president of the Ojai Valley Museum. I know in discussions with Wendy and I think it's the heating system which is currently gas driven is something that has been discussed needing to be replaced. And so I'm just putting that two bits out. Have enjoyed fine presentation being on the other, on your side Lindsay throughout my career. So just again the museum I think that's a big item whether it hits your capital expenditure threshold or not that's up to you okay thank you very much.
Thank You Brian any comments online?
Yes mayor we have one comment online from Michelle Ellison. Michelle you may now unmute your mic
Good evening. I appreciate the projects being proposed for climate and reducing emissions. It's a good start so thank you, thank you. I just want to highlight though the urgency and magnitude of the climate crisis that we're facing and that we should really be increasing the priority and amount that we're allocating for decarbonization projects in this year's CIP budget and all years thereafter until we have achieved zero emissions for our city operations.
As drafted, I noticed that only one percent of next year's CIP budget is allocated for getting off fossil fuel gas in our city buildings and this is just much too little and does not reflect our community support for climate action So we can and must do much more and do it quickly. Our five-year plan should account for full electrification of all city buildings along with energy efficiency measures, and electrification of all of our fleet and acknowledging some of the constraints we're facing but we should really be fast tracking all of these projects so let's get the CIP to comprehensively capture that goal So I'd recommend that we see where money can be moved from other line items in the budget that are less urgent or necessary. You know, let's evaluate what our wants versus what our needs and reallocate funding to getting off fossil fuels in earnest.
I think about it kind of like let's deal with this crisis at hand. This is an existential devastatingly costly climate breakdown that we're facing And let's deal with that, do our part. Achieve zero emissions here in our community and then we can get on to doing the other wonderful things that we all want for our community. So I just want to thank you and gratitude to city staff for all of your work on this as well.
Thank you, Michelle.
That's all for
online. All right. We'll move on to discussion who would like to begin?
We can take it from there. So I think that the motion is that
1:44 – 1:4611 turns
We move to adopt this preliminary CIP. I don't know if it would be preliminary. Yeah,
yeah, I would suggest American Council you might phrase the motion is direct staff to move forward with the CIP as proposed for consideration and adoption at a future meeting Because we're not adopting it tonight.
Yes, right exactly yes I See that our city clerk is writing that as we speak Perhaps you could read it back to us and then we could if it has a second we could move forward there a second for the motion
I'll second if it includes all the comments that we spoke of.
Would you please read back the motion?
Roll-call vote Moved by Leslie Rule · Seconded by Suza Francina
Show transcript
correct. Any final comments?
Yeah, I just want to support what Ms. Ellison had to say that we should look at every way that we can reduce our carbon impacts on the community. We should show the example to homeowners of reducing Carbon-based emissions and And we should do things aggressively within our Projects and programs to achieve that goal
I Would just like to reiterate that thank you for saying that and also once again, thank you so much We have an incredible public's Public Works director and staff. So we are grateful All right. Are we ready for a roll call?
Roll-call vote Passed 5–0
Show transcript
Motion passes 5-0.
Okay wonderful all right let's take a very brief break and we will be back thank you
Here's all the details.
1:56 – 2:104 turns
Okay, if everybody could take your seats we will get going. We are back. Okay, if everybody could please come to quiet. We are moving on to, actually is there any public communications? This is our public communications remainder. Do we have any? Nope. Okay all right
we will move on to item number three design review permit and plan development permit for proposed three building 15 unit deed restricted affordable housing project on 304 South Montgomery Street and we have a staff report yes thank you
Thank You Madam Mayor if I could pull up the slide deck James please Ah, there it is. Good evening my name is Lucas Seibert I'm the Community Development Director for the City of Ojai. The item you have before you tonight is a project at 15 unit 100% affordable housing project located at 304 South Montgomery Street next slide please A little bit of background very briefly here, the developer is Ojai Bungalows LP and this is really a part of a settlement agreement that was reached and brought before this council at the December 18th meeting of last year.
That includes four project sites, this being one of them A mix of deed-restricted affordable housing and market rate housing, and then a timeline for public hearing process. And really what that piece means is what we're seeing tonight. This item actually went before the Planning Commission on two different meetings but then had a recommendation on March 20th of this year to come before this body.
The proposed project itself includes the development of 15 units deed restricted for rent, affordable housing project consisting of residential units only. Next slide please. Where is this at? Okay, we can take a look at that. Oh they went blank. Where is this located? As we're working through some technical pieces here. South of Ojai Avenue north of Ojia Valley Trail on the east side of Montgomery Street to the west is Libbey Park surrounding it on the north and west to certain degree is residential The zoning is Village Mixed Use, or VMU. That is consistent with the general plan designation of Village Mixed Use as well. The lot size is about .62 acres in area.
A little bit of fun history, this site itself did have a single-family residential single story house on it, as well as an accessory structure really tucked towards the rear to the east portion of the lot. That was then demo'd right around 2016. Next slide please. The why, why is this project coming forward? Well there are housing laws that are now in place one is SB 330, one is the Housing Accountability Act which was referred to as HA and another is state density bonus law which continues to evolve and change and manifests itself over time year after year sometimes mid-year SB 330 really prohibits local jurisdictions from enacting new laws that would have the effect of reducing the legal limit on new housing within their borders, within the City of Ojai's jurisdictional boundaries.
Or delaying new housing via administrative or other regulatory barriers. What does that mean? Once an SB 330 application is submitted for an affordable housing project, it basically freezes our rules. So if we come up with a new rule or new law that law does not impact that particular project. In terms of the Housing Accountability Act, or the HAW, it limits local government's ability to disapprove or delay housing development projects for arbitrary reasons. Preponderance of the evidence is one of the pieces that's used.
Fairly strict and fairly difficult in terms of addressing that hurdle. The third is the state density bonus law, and that has really evolved over the past probably three to five years. It affords a developer of a housing project certain benefits if the development includes a threshold number of affordable units. Those development benefits include a density bonus which is an increase in the number of units on a particular site. Concessions or incentives, which are basically taking our standards and curbing them to a certain degree or reducing them. Waivers, which are basically arguments to waive any of our standards that are being requested. And then parking ratios using density bonus law parking standards, which are greatly reduced in terms of how we address parking.
Next slide please. From a site design standpoint, here you can see the site itself on the west which is to the left is Montgomery Street not Ojai Avenue. To the north is a single family residential use which is just to the top. To the bottom is a vacant piece of land and then to the east is a substation for Edison. The site itself is 15 studio units spread amongst three buildings. Building one, building two, building three you can see those here. Building one is a single level building it contains three units. Building two is a two-story building containing seven units.
Building three is a partial two-story building kind of tucked towards the back and that contains five units three on the bottom two on top With the 15 studio units we're talking about here, it also includes 15 parking spaces which is per density bonus law. A one-to-one ratio when you have a studio or one bedroom as proposed and that's what we have here. There's also a central courtyard with a central feature that is to be worked out at this moment could be a water feature, it could also be a heritage tree Landscaping is proposed to be native, drought-tolerant pallet and preservation of existing oak trees is also being considered and included.
One thing to note on the north side which is at the very top you can see a little pork chop that actually was put in order to preserve two oak trees that are currently on site. Next slide please The site itself is 100% affordable. What does that look like? Well, 12 of those units are moderate income. That's 80% of the total units. Three of those units are low-income units. That's 20%. Next slide please.
What does that mean? Affordability distribution. As a low level and as a moderate three and the 12, low is households earning no more than 80% of the area median income. Moderate then means households earning no more than 120% of the area median income. What does the area median income mean? Well, as of 2013 and certainly or 2023 and certainly we'll see in 2024 in the coming weeks once HCD releases their new numbers. Ventura County's area median income is 123,500 And that's for an area median income of four persons household.
Next slide, please. The VMU zone allows for eight units per acre per the Ojai Municipal Code. The project is proposing 15 units on 0.62 acres. How do we reach the desired density in this case? Let's do a quick math equation fairly simple straightforward. It's state density bonus law plus A planning tool or permit that is allowed within the Ojai Municipal Code, which is a planned development permit or the PDP. Next slide please.
Density bonus breakdown. As I mentioned in the previous slide it's eight units to the acre. Eight units into .62 yields 4.96 per density bonus law we round that up to five units. We take that five units And attach, based on the makeup of their affordability, a 35% density bonus. That 35% density bonus equates to 1.75 density. That then is added to the five that gets us to 6.75 again rounding up to seven units.
Seven units is what will be allowed without a proposed PDP which is we have next slide please. With the increase from 7 to 15, that's a roughly 115% increase. That then requires the necessity for a planned development permit which is what's before this council tonight as well. A design review permit as well as a planned development permit. Next slide please The plan development permit itself is and allows for maximum flexibility in site planning, property development. It also protects the integrity and character of Ojai Wills encouraging creative and innovative development projects. It is really a planning tool for projects within the VMU zone and City Council approval is required for applications regarding density increase.
In a nutshell, planned development permits are instead of doing a variance. This is what we're talking about. There is no variance process when we're looking at the village mixed use zone itself. It's this process. Next slide please. From a density bonus standpoint, it's incentives and concessions parking waivers. The incentives concessions the project qualifies as an affordable housing mix project to development incentives.
In this case, the developer is only requesting one concession and that is a reduction in the landscaping width development standard. It will be reduced to two feet along the eastern edge of the property. Typically it's six feet. That's the minimum requirement. From a parking standpoint, the Ojai Municipal Code calls for 23 parking spaces. That's if we're applying the strictest standard of our parking requirements. State density bonus law allows for a reduced parking demand which is 15 parking spaces or a one-parking space for each bedroom knowing that the bedrooms themselves are studios or one bedrooms it's a one parking space requirement for each unit From a waiver standpoint, no waivers are being requested at this moment or as part of this project.
Next slide please. Project takeaways. The address or addresses housing shortages, there's a shortage of affordable housing in both Ojai and California as a whole that is identified through our RENA numbers, our Regional Housing Needs Allocation. The local developer, as a local developer they are familiar with Ojai's character. It is not a developer that's coming outside of the city, it is a developer that actually lives in the city.
The regional housing needs allocation or the RHNA numbers allocates regional specific numbers for affordable housing that provides for the opportunity of the developer or property owner to develop affordable housing through an objective review process which is what we have tonight. In here is also our RENA numbers. I think we're all familiar with those, it's 53 that is our target number. With the settlement agreement and with other projects that we've had come forward before this body, we're getting to a net zero.
Next slide please. With that, staff is making recommendations. That feels like a stock photo, sorry. City Council to consider the following. Receive the information and presentation provided by staff and the applicant developer. It's a fresh look. Asking clarifying questions of staff and applicant of this proposal and then open the matter for public comment.
And then lastly, consider the resolution and associated conditions and approve the project located at 304 South Montgomery. That is a part of the resolution which is attachment A to the staff report.
Thank you Mr. Siebert that was lovely. Nice looking lentils too. Any questions from Council?
2:10 – 2:1726 turns
This is part of a settlement agreement that has multiple other parts. In other words, there are other projects that are in the pipeline moving forward and is our resolution here contingent upon the other parts of the agreement being complied with.
So each, each of these projects and there's four in total so this is one of them. This is one resolution for this particular project moving forward. So as this continues to move forward dependent on the council's determination tonight this project will then move as a part of the settlement agreement towards plan check, which is basically going through building and other pieces.
With that is also requirements for an affordable housing agreement to be addressed as well, as well as a number of other conditions that are spelled out within the resolution. All those need to be followed as a part of this particular project was a part of the whole sum of the settlement agreement.
And if I could add, Mayor and Council, the four are also approved individually. So of the four we have Cottages, Mallory, Montgomery and 510 East Ojai. Cottages was already issued building permits as part of the settlement. Mallory is in process for a revised site design. Montgomery is tonight having been recommended for the Planning Commission for approval and here would subject to council And 510 East OI was approved by the Planning Commission, which is its final step last week.
So that's where we are in the four.
Right. But each of the pieces needs to move through for the whole thing?
The whole thing is all four together build the agreement and all four need are moving together and need to keep moving but each approval will be separate
Yeah. So if the developer decided for some reason not to do one of the projects, not suggesting that that's in the cards, but that would potentially unravel the whole thing?
Yes, it could risk that then the developer hasn't suggested they're doing that, but that would
be right. I just want to make sure that part of what we're doing here is is that were We're approving of a multifaceted agreement that doesn't just involve this particular site plan, correct?
Through the mayor. A quick clarifying question. This is exactly the proposal that we unanimously agreed to. Is that correct?
Through the settlement agreement? Yeah. That's the question.
That is the question through the settlement agreement.
Unit count, yes.
Okay thank you and everything else was based on coming before us anyway but nothing has changed fundamentally on unit count or what we agreed to in
terms of density now.
Thank you
If I could add to that, both the unit count and affordability mix is exactly as was approved in the settlement agreement. Correct?
Thank you. Actually, I have a question, Lucas. For the community's edification, do you know how much the rent is per month? for median and low income. Uh-oh, you were ready! Thank you.
Well it's a question that came up when we brought this forward to Planning Commission so we had already prepped. So for low and moderate is what we're looking at here I have a sliding scale of one to six because really it's dependent on the number of persons per within the household itself So as a one-person household, the low income would be at $1,860 at the highest end. For moderate it would be $2,593.75 for one person household, the moderate. That's at the highest level. Could you repeat that please? Sure. So for low income... I have that.
1,860. So the second one is 2,593.75 and those are numbers from 2023 we're awaiting HCD to come out with the numbers for 2024 which should be within the coming weeks
any other questions from council
yeah I have a just clarifying question so that's the highest and so in other words that's the ceiling correct and there is a floor and it has to do with what the total household income is as well. Yes, so this is assuming that they make the high end of the percentage of the range for the low or the moderate? Correct. Okay thank you.
And then through the mayor, then we also have the provision that these units are let first to Ojai residents that meet the ordinance that we adopted earlier this year. Correct
Yeah, the local tenant preference policy will be applied to these projects as it states
and I guess the other thing that's important for the Thank you, Mr. Chairman and members of the public. HCD and are the potential for a builder's remedy, which means that we lose a lot of the control that we're exercising here tonight.
Yeah. Hands are tied pretty tightly without without those. Yes.
Yeah OK.
Yes, that's correct. The builder's revenue for those not familiar with it is provision in state law that allows a city that lacks a substantially compliant housing element essentially lacks local control over any housing project which could be approved regardless of any aspect of our local ordinances. Having achieved a substantially compliant housing element and an HCD certified housing element and with this project and the others Cabrillo and the other Becker projects collectively having met ARENA significantly increases our ability to enforce our local ordinances
2:17 – 2:2416 turns
Thanks
General state law requires landlords to allow pets in this context and that will be baked into the affordability agreement subject to reasonable regulations thereof
Yes
Yes, this project will allow pets.
Okay thank you.
All right well let's go ahead and move on to public comment. Thank you so much Lucas much appreciated. First we have Bill Miley. We also have a card with no name if anybody... okay Star Child yeah all right
I read over the entire administrative report and the drafted resolution, including all of the conditions of approval. As conveyed at the recent Planning Commission meeting, I again fully support this affordable housing project. I fully appreciate the determination, persistence and the frustration tolerance of the Becker Group bringing this positive project to planning completion.
It is especially important to be aware the developer will be subsidizing these affordable units for cost differences between affordable limited rents and the cost of building and maintaining them for the needed time period of 55 years. There's no outside federal or state money I support your council in its final review and the approval of this needed affordable housing project for our city.
The need is great, and this is an important step forward. Thank you.
Thank you Bill. Next we have Starchild.
Hello, good evening. I'd like to speak in favor of the proposed housing development. I think Ojai needs a lot more affordable housing. In fact, I think that the arena numbers might be a little bit too low. I understand that the last cycle eight years ago, that arena number was closer to 300 and now it's 53 and I don't think 300 units were built in that time. Am I not making any noise?
Okay, I'm good. All right. I don't think 300 units were built in that time. In fact, I think that the number was closer to zero than 300 and really, I think the number is missing a lot of people. I think it's missing some of the workers who are driving into Ojai who would much rather live here than commute here I think it's missing the 38 people living out in the parking lot. I think it's missing the people at the laundromat who would much rather be doing their clothes, washing their clothes at home and spending time with their families.
And because of all that I think that this council not only should approve this project but shouldn't should approve even more. I Think that if anybody's willing especially without Taxpayer subsidy to develop a property for our community members to have a place to live Maybe even a better place Than the one they have now maybe even a safer place than the old department that maybe they have now I think that this council should approve it We don't need subsidies to be able to live here affordably. We just need the council to get out of the way And so I encourage you to do that Thank You
Thank You star child any comments online?
Yes, ma'am. We have one comment online for teal row Teal you may now unmute your mic
Thank you, and I really appreciate the plan and development to include the two mature oak trees with the pork chop driveway that you added since the Planning Commission meeting. Thank you for saving two oaks. I hope they make it through. I didn't say at the Planning Commission meeting but I would like it to be on record that it is on the Edison station and if you're a sensitive person like I am, I can feel everything when I walk down there because everybody was saying they couldn't hear anything. They couldn't feel anything to me it vibrates my body on the bike path so i hope that the city can um I don't know what it's called but protect protect the city from anything in the future that would bring health issues to the city in a roundabout way and to any sensitive person that ends up living there.
And I'm concerned about that, and I was concerned about it from day one. I think I do have it on record from years ago. Thank you for listening All the best. Thanks. Thank you,
Teal. That's it?
That's it.
All right. We'll move on to discussion. Who would like to begin?
So I bought this property with the developer and his arborist, and I think there was one other person with us over things over a year ago. Yeah. And I too am delighted that he's not only saving the oaks, but some of the other bushes and things that are there. My memory is that the electric is in the back and then there's gonna be parking and some bushes or some kind of a buffer for the housing. The design is really good. I'm thrilled to see this coming before us.
2:24 – 2:295 turns
Thank you so much, Lucas. I shared in Teal's concerns about the potential EMF exposure but upon seeing the designs and seeing that there is Park that there's space between where people are going to be sleeping and living, and that area. I felt good about it. This is a project we've talked a lot about, and I am in support of it. I'm also really happy to see all of the climate measures that the developer put into place Everything's going to be electrified electric It's you know, all the landscaping is going to be drought tolerant You know I was I was really really pleased to see even in the way it even in the plans That you know I think I think it's gonna fit within the look and feel of that community And so I was uh, I was prepared to come in skeptical.
Uh, you know And I was really just pleasantly surprised with all of the thought and the care that went into developing this, including as Council Member Francina mentioned having the space and the landscaping to hopefully counterbalance some of the potential impacts Thank you.
I am also in support of it. I did a little bit of research on EMF and invisible areas of energy can be radiation, but there's nothing in law that stops anyone from building near a station. So it's not a Quatal, it's not anything that we can point to in any law that we could do anything with. Not that I would probably be inclined to do that anyway because I think invisible areas of energy can be very powerful and I would like to harness that and send it out to some people.
That having been said, I'm going to go ahead and make a motion that we approve the design review permit DRP23009 and the plan development permit PDP24001 regarding the proposed three building 15 unit deed restricted affordable housing project at 304 South Montgomery Street. I'll
second it. Okay. Any comments?
Yeah, I have some comments. So I wish that when we were talking about affordable housing, that we were doing better on the rents than we are. But I know that this is the playing field that the state has laid out for us and I actually don't want to view that as a negative because I think the developer did quite a bit to come to the city with means through some of the other projects, as well as this one.
Achieve a lot of the city's goals for housing I Think if I recall this was this piece of property in the prior agreement was a much More dense project than it is going to be. And I think that it's a tremendous improvement at what we're looking at and what we're approving so you know, I hope we can at some point in time We can convince the state that what's affordable across the state is not necessarily achieving the affordability issues that we have in Ojai, but I think we've done the best we can do with this project and everybody should be congratulated for putting it together.
And I would just like to echo my colleagues' comments. Thank you very much, and thank you to our Community Development Director, and thank you to Mr. Becker and co for working together in working this out. It's a great project, and of course we all know that what we really need are units for extremely low, acutely low, and very low income. That's a different discussion.
That we can talk about later those are you know for people who are living, you know in the encampment For example and because those rents still are quite high for a lot of our community members on the other hand given that You know, we're meeting the parameters and Saving the trees going all electric drought tolerant wonderful aspects of this project. So Seems like we're ready for a roll call Yeah
2:29 – 2:3832 turns
I'm very aware of the rent on the Ojai housing sites, and this would be considered the lowest rent. I can guarantee if you go look on that site, anything that's under $2,000, you'll have 40 applicants. It's like almost unheard of these days for housing like this. So thank you. And of course, we do need other types of like a tiny home village and all that different discussion.
We need other alternatives for low, low, low income. I agree with that. But the other great thing is the location people can walk to town in two or three minutes and that is worth a lot. You can save hundreds of gas and car you know, you can even live without a car there which would save someone hundreds of dollars I'm Makes it even more affordable. Thank you.
And you can have pets, which is important and pets too. Yeah, I don't we don't think you'll have any trouble filling those units
in District 4. All
right. Roll call please.
Roll-call vote 0–0 Moved by Leslie Rule · Seconded by Rachel Lang · 2 under review
Show transcript
to approve item number three as recommended. Council Member Ruhl
Yes.
Mayor Sticks?
Yes.
Council Member Francina?
Yes.
Mayor Pro Tem Whitman? Yes Council Member Lange?
Yes
Motion passes 5-0
Wonderful, all right thank you very much All right
we will move on to agenda item number four update and request to complete effort for temporary encampment at Kent Hall parking lot We have a staff report.
Yes, Mayor, I'd like to welcome you to the low tech part of your meeting. You decide what you can compete with and what you can't compete with as far as PowerPoints. And I just said, you know, I'm not going to compete with competition, no
competition,
especially that being that bean slide. Yeah, that was something OK. Was it was great? So let's talk about the unhoused encampment here at the greater Kent Hall parking lot. There's been a lot of talk, not only tonight during the public comment but also last week of course with the city's successful receipt of the grant from the state. That's awesome. You know that's going to be for constructing you know the permanent pathway to housing.
But what that is not addressing is our immediate need and that's what we're here to talk about tonight. We are still in the process of building out the temporary solution at the greater Kent Hall parking lot. What does that mean? That means we're following Council's direction to get the campers out of the woodland and the creek area up into the parking lot and the greater parking lot area.
So we have been successful, we've really worked hard to quickly mobilize and as a result of doing that, we expended my spending authority. And not by an inconsiderable amount, it's $50,000 plus that we expended my spending authority. But we were following Council direction to get people out of the woodland and the creek, let that sensitive area exist and create a more manageable and sanitary and safe encampment which is what we have done in the greater parking lot area. We have 17 tents on platforms currently. We have 12 more that we need to construct But aside from needing to have you ratify the expenditures that were made over my spending authority, I also need your authorization to go out to bid. Because at this point we've now created a project that's large enough that it requires a formal bid process for what remains and that's the 12 platforms and tents that are remaining.
So that will put us at 29 for the tents in the platforms in this area That is the number of unhoused that we had camping in the area at the date in December when it was closed to any additional camping, if you're wondering how we arrived at that number. And that is what we anticipate that we will need to address while we work on the long-term solution away from Kent Hall to use our grant proceeds which is a separate topic which we'll talk to you about at a different meeting. So, two things I'm asking you for tonight. Ratifying the expenditures that were made to build the 17 tents and platforms and then getting your authority to go out to bid for the remaining 12 that remain to be constructed. And I'm happy to answer questions if you have them.
Thank you very much.
Any questions?
So the staff report was prepared before we received the grant. OK, and I was that's correct. One of the letters about how the funding goes but we cannot read can we No, no
we cannot and then right and but I will I will tell you it's a it's an interesting question And thank you for bringing it up. I Believe in and others have said this to that part of the reason that we were successful in our grant application is because what we have done here with our temporary effort and what we were Willing to do to build it out. I think that commitment really showed that that Ojai City Council cared and the community cared and that was probably one of the reasons why we were awarded The entire amount that we asked for and since you also brought it up on the staff report I also wanted to give a shout-out to Sarah Cameli who's not here with us tonight, but who wrote a very excellent staff report She's one of our new additions to her Planning department and she raised her hand and said hey, I'd like to be involved in this effort What can I do?
And I said have I got an assignment. So anyway, thank you Sarah for a great staff report
Any other questions All right, we'll move on any public
no, I actually have a question, I'm sorry so I know that when the First phase of building platforms took place there was There was quite a bit of What I understood to be volunteer. labor come in and help us build the platform. So with the going out to bid process, are we eliminating that? How do we encourage the volunteerism that we experienced last go around and potentially save some of our money for other projects?
It's an excellent question the Mayor Pro Tem asks. I would say it depends, you know there is not a requirement for the contractor submitting a bid to include volunteer component we could certainly write that up as recommended to allow for volunteer participation and that would be a good suggestion we can add that I think it's going to depend on who we award the bid to. And I will tell you, I don't know that this is going to be hugely attractive to a large number of contractors. I am aware of a couple that have expressed interest in bidding on it.
The other challenge with this second phase of the buildout is this is the part that kind Down the hill from from oak house towards the barn if you will or the carriage house, whatever we're calling it There's a big slope there. And so it really does kind of require some Contractor expertise and knowledge you're essentially building decks down there But I think it's great suggestion we can put in the in the bid You know that were encouraging volunteer participation and please detail how that might be possible with your response if you think that's acceptable
Give me a big turn of the bids and as noted it's somewhat of a different project to have building existing facilities on asphalt versus engineering or designing it and building it on the dirt.
Yeah, by the way I think a lot of credit should go to those folks who did come out and volunteer and get this project rolling. I understand it was a pretty impressive thing to see
And it remains today. We still have a number of volunteers who show up every week and contribute, so thank you. That's an excellent point.
Okay we'll move on to public comment. Any comments online? None in the House.
We do not have any public comments online.
Okay let's move on to discussion. Oh I'm sorry.
Hi
Jerry.
2:39 – 2:4719 turns
He's getting some paperwork.
We're participating with our community and our values, considering all concerns being addressed. I share the concerns. I am one of the fellows that are disadvantaged with this encampment. I introduced myself before if you remember me, Jerry William Odell also known as Tree Bear I am fully transparent. Go ahead and screen me, I've mentioned that before and it has been done. You'll find a good record even a good driving record.
I've been completely free from alcohol and drugs for over 33 plus years. Thanksgiving Day will be 34 years. That having to do with my good record? Yes there is connecting the dots. Anyhow getting to the matter at hand presently What we have here is a proposal. What I wrote, been jotting down here, it says all must be considered regarding grant funding where resources are actually needed regarding eco tiny homes I'm proposing myself, offering myself up for the Tiny Homes Projects and the grant funding in case I run out of time to do this extensive proposal.
Operational expenses, tool supplies, resources, materials, listing locations all must be considered with genuine consideration and compassion to what has been ignored for too long Request of proposal from community of Ojai. Reasoning of needs, of concerns, of disabilities and abilities that need to be addressed and Recognized and considered considering individuals needs, family community requests requesting overseeing assigned overseer report of observation and evaluation. What has transpired since June of 2023?
And recent development is. Here we go, that there has been a denial of individual and neighboring community concerns with integrity in regards to the safety and health and justice for all. So as we pledge of allegiance to the flag... Thank
you Jerry, appreciate it. Thank you. I'm sorry, we're gonna have to stop now. Thank you Any comments online?
No, we have no comments online there.
Okay, let's uh, oh Hi Ryan come on up
I'm a little shorter than everyone else. Hello. First off, good to see everyone. I've been a member for the past few years since 2020 and my name is Ryan Bosch. I used to work on Planning Commission with Lucas Cyber and Finance Committee with Pam Greer. I just wanted to ask two questions for the city manager, Mr. Harvey For the homeless funding the twelve point six million dollars we received recently which is fantastic How will the state be doling out that money?
And when we will when will we be receiving that money? Will it be in phases lump sum and how will we be spending that?
Through the mayor okay to respond. Okay So it's our understanding, and we do have a meeting with the state on Friday. We just received the award letter and some details so we're sorting it out but it appears that the entire amount will be provided to the city by July. That's how it appears. However with that, and this is consistent with what the governor said in the news conference where the mayor was representing the city there are going to be progress measurements along the way. So that's how they're going to ensure that you're complying with what you said you were going to do in your grant application. But we will be providing more details once we know that. Again, we wanna have a discussion with the state to make sure we fully understand what's required.
Okay, awesome. Because I noticed that sum of money was the largest awarded in that meeting for that round and so I just want to make sure there is a review process in place annually to make sure we are actively engaging with the spending and making sure it's not being misappropriated but lost at the cracks. And then the other thing was, I know that Proposition 1 with the state passed recently. It was a close vote but I know what that means for the counties is that $140 million across the state counties will be taken And go to the state, and that may take away outreach services for homeless people. And so I wonder what can the city do to increase the homeless outreach efforts which they did an amazing job for the grant funding and I'm so proud of them.
But what can we do as a city and as a community, make sure that they don't lose any funding or they don't lose any support from the city standpoint? And can we in any way supplement that for the county and start being a leader within the county.
So again through the mayor, I don't necessarily have a response for that. The only thing I will say is that typically Health and Human Services is a county function less a municipal function. We don't have a revenue stream to provide that but as you're seeing we are stepping up in this area quite a bit. We're committing some general fund money towards that effort so of the in-house that is which you could consider obviously health and human services But a bigger question that I don't have an answer for at this time. The other thing I'd like to mention is the Assistant City Manager reminded me just now that within your proposed budget we are going to be creating a separate account for the funding we're receiving from the state for this effort, for tracking and accountability purposes.
And I'll just add that all of that separate funding is also subject to audit through our annual audit process so the opportunity for funds to disappear is very limited It'll all be tracked, separately funded and then comply with the grant requirements.
Great questions Ryan, thank you. And just so you know that the Governor's Senior Advisor on Homelessness is coming next week for a meeting.
Is that like a public meeting?
That's an operational implementation meeting that will be closed to the public but we'll get information out regarding the grant process as it
goes. I think it would be lovely to have at some point a little public outing with her because that would increase transparency and allow the public to feel.
Definitely report back.
Okay. Yeah, I see I have 50 seconds left so I should wrap this up Any other questions that I had those are really the main points and wanted to hit home today? Oh With CIP funding for the
we have to just stick to homelessness with this
issue okay That's that's perfectly fine Then in the last 20 seconds, I'll say a fantastic effort by everyone. I'm so glad to hear we got the funding and that we were actually able to do the outreach efforts. And I think at the end of the day as long as we're prudent and mindful about the spending, the outreach efforts, and making sure that all the dots are connected and we take the holistic approach, I think it will come out pretty good. I think the.
Thank you, Ryan. Thank you. Any comments online?
2:47 – 2:5724 turns
No, we have no comments online.
All right. We will move on to discussion who would like to begin with a motion.
Yeah. Sure. Mm hmm. All right. Make a motion of this read one and two. Correct. We ratify expenditures made to date that exceed the city manager's spending authority for the temporary unhoused encampment project and direct staff to proceed with the formal bidding process for the remaining tent platforms, sheds and tents. And delegate the power to the city manager to enter into a contract with the lowest responsive and responsible bidder with existing budgetary authority And then we could add a comment about the volunteers.
Is there a second? I'll second it. All right, any final comments before roll
call? Yeah, I think that staff starting with our interim city manager and picking up with Mr. Harvey and the rest of the staff have done Really a tremendous job on taking what was a pretty scary situation and making it more organized and suitable for our unhoused encampment. And looking forward to a good future for this.
Just thank Ruth Miller, because it was about a year ago that we first met at Love Social Cafe just under the oak tree and little did I dream that a year later here we would be. And also many thanks to Mark Scott and all the people that over the period of month countless people came to the initial meetings and then the White Valley Democratic Club Had a forum and brought Dignity Moves to Ojai. And I think you went to visit Santa Barbara? You know, everyone was involved in some way. So thank you everyone. Good job!
I'd just like to echo those thanks to everyone involved and also Jen Harkey from the county who worked really. And also Rick Rain. Can we give him a hand? Thank you, Rick. You work so hard and do such a great job at supporting people and helping people and maintaining order out of chaos. So thank you. All right, are we ready for a roll call?
Roll-call vote 0–0 Moved by Suza Francina · Seconded by Rachel Lang · 2 under review
Show transcript
I believe you snuck in there to approve item four as recommended with an amendment to add a volunteer component to the bidding process. Council Member Francina?
Yes.
Council Member Lange?
Yes
Mayor Pro Tem Whitman?
Yes
Mayor Stixx? Yes Council Member Ruhle?
Yes
Motion passes 5-0
All right, we will move on to item number five extension of professional services agreement with Avant Garde Incorporated for additional services relating to phase one of the active transportation program ATP. We have a staff report.
Yes, Mayor. Continuing with the low-tech portion of your meeting I'd actually like to talk about items five and six together if that's acceptable to the Council and okay everybody is good with that they're related here we are this is a follow up to unanimous vote council direction back in September last year wherein you directed staff to move forward with phases one and two of the ATP project. This tonight what we're talking about, two components they only deal with phase one just to make it simple that's the portion that's the dedicated bike lane in front of Nordoff High School that chunk the Maricopa Highway section of the project so We need from you two things to follow that direction, to move things forward this evening. One, we need help.
We need help in putting this project out to bid. You may ask yourselves why do you need that? You seem to put things out to bid all the time pretty easily. We just did that earlier. Well, that's true. But this is a little different. This is a Caltrans project. It has a lot of very specific requirements A lot of interface with a complicated state agency. A lot of ways that you can run afoul if you don't know what you're doing. So we've identified somebody who knows what they're doing and actually, who has been involved with the project for some time and that's Avant Garde. They have been involved on the grant administration side. They raised their hand shortly after I came on board and said, hey we can see that you do not have the bandwidth or the ability to do this.
If you'd like for us to help you with this, we can. And they came forward with what I believe is a very reasonable proposal not to exceed $45,000 to get us all the way through the bid process. In fact if council takes direction tonight on the other item that we're gonna get to in a second They're ready to go out to bid tomorrow. In fact, they've already prepared things. It's ready to be put out on the websites and they're good to go. I should mention we have a couple important people here with us this evening from the Ventura County Transportation Authority. Peter DeHaan, Heather Miller, they are both here.
The meeting so far, thank you for doing that. They've been with this project for a long, long time and I think they want to see for themselves that this is actually going to possibly move forward this evening. So that's why they're here in person just to see it with their own eyes but they are also the subject matter experts and they've got the historical background if there are questions. I would certainly welcome directing it to them because they know a lot more than I do about this project. That's part one which is getting this professional services agreement Extended so that we can have somebody on board to do the bid effort to answer the questions from the contractors, do the advertising etc. Okay The second part is actually given us the authorization to go out to bid itself.
That's a separate action It's a formal action you need to Give us that authority and so that we can go out to bed and you can see with this item Well a couple things going back to the prior item I received a little bit of criticism from the public, and it was totally merited. Where's all the details about this project? Well, I included a hyperlink in agenda item number five to the very detailed staff report that interim city manager Mark Scott wrote back in September. So if you click on that hyperlink on the digital copy, of course, takes you back to the staff report that goes through the various funding sources, the grants, the timeline, the scope, the impediments, et cetera, et cetera.
So that's there. Jumping forward now to the actual request for the authorization to go out to bid, the only I think item that I'd like to call your attention to on that is the attachment which shows you the scope of the project. You can see that from folding it out. area in between the arrows you know the end construction to begin construction you can see this is the phase one of the ATP project the Maricopa Highway section with the Nordoff High School section if you will, dedicated bike lanes that is the area that we're talking about. If this does go out to bid tomorrow as we hope it will be expect to receive uh... a number of bids and come back to you before the end of June um... with a recommended selection So that we can be in compliance with the grant, receive the monies.
And then construction can hopefully begin in roughly the July-ish time frame with a thought that this project could be finished in the fall. That's kind of a rough... Now, of course there could be things that happen that move that around a little bit but that's a really rough potential timeline. So if again, if you have questions we've got the experts here and also Lindy has endured and stuck around too. Thank You Lindy And we'd be happy to answer those questions for you. Thank you
In spite of all our
assurance They want to know if there will be emergency vehicle and fire access, so maybe this is a good time.
Okay great so let's just jump into that right away. So I have a witness next to me it's the City Attorney Chief Parker was just here earlier he had he had to leave but we decided to ambush him with that question once again we'd already asked of him again but he assured us that yes Ventura County Fire actually drove this location to prove that it actually was Feasible on top of that. This is a Caltrans approved design, which it would never make it through the Caltrans design approval if it didn't appropriately allow for emergency vehicle
access Yeah
So we had a prior meeting and there's been more than one but we I Kind of went through the site plan, the striping and everything in kind of probably too much detail. But all of those things that we adopted then are incorporated into what's going out to bid now.
That's correct, okay and thank you sorry through the mayor so right this is as the Mayor Pro Tem is pointing out this is not the time to revisit the design that's happened you've given direction you've said move forward put it out to bid those days are long gone yes but you know the concerns that were brought up that could be incorporated that were allowed by Caltrans are baked into this
2:57 – 3:0426 turns
My this looks great wonderful my one question if construction is going to beginning in July When school goes back to session end of August are there just I'm just concerned about that other Considerations being
this will all have to be addressed as part of the construction management portion of the project So when the bids awarded we'll be better able to answer some of these questions,
okay?
So I know you clarified about the fire and the safety, but I just want to double check that you talked with the chief also about the Fire Safe Council's intention to have Nordoff as a fire shelter or an emergency shelter.
Chief Parker, thank you. Through the mayor, Chief Parker said they have absolutely zero safety concerns about this location with anything going on around there. They felt 100 percent confident and were supportive of the project.
Thank you. Great. All right. We will move on to public comment. No one in the house. Anybody online?
We have one comment online here. Renee, you may unmute your mic.
Thank you very much. I'm pleased that you have a project manager hired to do this project and that was holding a lot of things up, was the right-of-way access for the easements along Maricopa Highway. And I'm just wondering what the status of those projects are and if all of that has been resolved? I would love to hear that that's all been resolved and everything can move ahead According to plans, but I know that there were some property owners who are holding out and causing litigation to possibly happen. I'd just love to hear some good news if that is not the case. Thank you.
Mayor and Council all right of what issues have been solved for phase one? Which is the phase we're discussing now Great thank you That's good news. Indeed.
All right, well we will move on to discussion. Who would like to begin? I
think we should just
make a
motion. Okay this is your... I guess I didn't want to speak,
right? No cards.
It
doesn't seem like there's anything we could say that given where things are going.
Looking good! You want to make a motion?
Yes, I'll just add these kind of projects Too much of my delight are happening all over Ventura County because I'm on the Ventura County Transportation Commission, so I'm aware of that. So I will first motion we'll just make do you want the whole thing right? Both, okay. I make a motion to authorize the approval of an extension to the professional services agreement with Avant Garde Incorporated for additional services relating to the bid phase for phase one of the active transportation project ATP in an amount not to exceed $45,000.
One motion would be sufficient put them all together. I'll just read those three recommendations I make a motion to authorize staff to solicit competitive bids and publish the notice inviting sealed bids for Maricopa Highway Active Transportation Project. Two, accept the determination by Caltrans that the project is categorically exempt from the California Environmental Quality Act, CEQA, and National Environmental Policy Act, NEPA.
And three, approve the plans and specifications for the Maricopa Highway ATP project.
Is there a second?
I'll second.
Any final comments before roll call?
One final comment and that is I know that this is a really This is a project that has mixed reviews in among our community and And I I do feel like moving forward with this You know with the request to solicit some help and to To begin the construction. I think that This is going to ensure that we have a project that we're happy with at the end. And so I just want to let all the people who have reached out to me personally with concerns about the project know that your concerns are heard, they're being considered as we move forward with phase one.
Thank you
Councilmember. Anyone else?
Yeah, I'll comment and that my support is largely because we're just talking about phase one. I would love to see when we get to phase two that were just looking at attaching this pathway to the county's recreation trail and that it seems like the CalTrans is taking care of a bunch of things that were contemplated in terms of the handicap access at streets downtown Ojai.
So I hope that we're not going to go too extensive in phase two, if at all. And I think that it's a really good move that we're making because there were some real serious safety concerns and actually some lives lost. And we're mitigating the danger of bicyclists and students at Nordoff getting to and from school
It's super exciting to get the bike trail off the road and separate cyclists and cars. That's the number one thing, so thank you very much for being here. Ready for a roll call?
Roll-call vote 0–0 Moved by Suza Francina · Seconded by Andrew Whitman · 2 under review
Show transcript
3:04 – 3:0925 turns
to approve items five and six as recommended. Mayor Stix?
Yes.
Council Member Lange?
Yes Yes.
Council Member Francina?
Yes.
Mayor Pro Tem Whitman? Yes. Motion passes 5-0.
Wonderful, well thank you for
coming. Do you have any idea where we're going to be getting to Phase 2 or is it too soon to ask?
Way too soon to ask but when we finish up Phase 1 we will come back to you and give you an accounting of what happened and then talk about getting direction for Phase 2. Okay,
thank
you. Promise.
Well that was amazing Council, we got through a lot of items and I did pull item i from the consent calendar so we actually have time. Surprise surprise! This is the short-term rental ordinance And I just wanted to look at one phrase. So if you could look at page seven of nine in the ordinance, we can all find that.
OK.
Seven of nine. Page
seven
of the of the of the ordinance itself.
So attached on page seven? Yep. Yeah.
Item G, and it's section 4-24.05 penalties and enforcement subsection G. Everybody? Okay. And the reason I wanted to discuss this tonight because I was looking, I actually watched the last meeting's video, and I confirmed that Mr. Summers made a statement that addressed the concerns raised about frivolous lawsuits so I'm gonna quote you if that's okay. You said, I await policy direction but I would note that the last sentence of the present language in part is protection against a frivolous or meritless lawsuit and that a defendant who was subjected to a suit that the court found frivolous and lacks any merit would recover attorney's fees. So this made me realize that notification rather than city consent is adequate. So I would suggest that in the first sentence of item G, it be modified to read any agreed person or entity who notifies the city a minimum of five days prior may bring a civil suit in an appropriate state or federal court to enforce any violation of this chapter.
So, and because requiring a third party who's going to file lawsuit to notify the city of their intention means that the city would be informed and then can choose to intervene if it's necessary. And one of the reasons I think this is important is because it would save the city considerable staff time to review the case And as Mr. Summers said, the last sentence of this subsection protects defendants from frivolous lawsuits. So I'm bringing that to Council to discuss.
I'm confused. So you want to not require, you want to change the requirement that the city investigate and validate? Is that, I'm confused.
I'm suggesting that that someone notifies the city if a person wants to notify the city a minimum of five days before bringing a civil suit. So and what I'm saying is that notification is enough rather than city consent, and the city, of course, because it's notified can always intervene . I think that last sentence, though, protects us from any frivolous lawsuit
So, in my understanding that you want to remove the city as being a median. or agreeing, I mean in other words what we said was that whoever had a claim would apply to the city to look at it and to assess it prior to a suit. And you want to take that away? Is that correct?
I'm suggesting that the person, the agreed person or entity would notify the city
Thank you very
much.
3:09 – 3:1715 turns
I don't understand then why you want to take that out if they're already protected. I think the idea that this is too much for the city, given that the city is the enforcement entity and I think that having an analysis by the city whether or not there was an infringement of the ordinance makes perfect sense. I think it will stop a frivolous lawsuit if the city were to deem this lawsuit to be frivolous prior to it going to court, that would save everybody. The point of this was to stop I mean you have bad tenants, you have bad landlords but it was really to stop bad actors from using this. I think the best way to stop bad actors from moving forward is to have a determination by the city and then if the people decide to move forward even with a determination by the city that this wasn't a violation So be it, but I think it would relieve a lot of the tension around the situation to have the enforcement body actually do an analysis.
I think it makes a huge amount of sense honestly to have the enforcement entity, the city who wrote the ordinance, who enforces the ordinance So, I'm going to go ahead and open it up for questions.
Is there, for the city attorney if I may. Is there a statute of limitations for presenting these kinds? If a neighbor wanted to present a case against another neighbor for going against the ordinance or having a short-term rental Is there a statute of limitations that would relate to the timing of the city's involvement and what we're talking about here?
I mean, typically it'd be a three year statute for a neighbor to file suit challenging a violation of the statute like this. So that's a three year window from the date of the violation for the neighbor to file suit. The ordinance doesn't impose a requirement on the city to give that decision on consent or not consent. The city staff would, of course, be reasonable in the amount of time they take to review the suit.
The council could put her a time constraint on the city consent line if it so desired. But yeah, the neighbors have three years to follow suit
Thank you. What is the can I ask another question? What is the typical and maybe this is for staff, what it would be that I know that our staff is limited. What would the typical turnaround time be for responding to someone who is a neighbor who's raising a concern around another about another neighbor?
We fairly quickly investigate torture and mental violations that are a priority for the city's enforcement team. We obviously don't have this kind of situation as yet because this is a new provision where it's the neighbors bringing the complaints on the way to court rather right now, the neighbor brings a complaint we investigate those fairly quickly and then take enforcement action as appropriate as we find on a fairly quick basis
So with what I'm understanding your recommendation is, it's to put a time limit on the city's involvement. Is that correct?
Yes, to move things forward faster and it would take less staff time. It just would make everything easier and more streamlined.
I just have a clarifying. Sorry, I'm sorry
Well,
I I was just gonna ask if you could repeat so my understanding is you want to take out the words with city consent and And replace them
with a minimum of five days. Any aggrieved person or entity who notifies the city a minimum of five days prior may bring a civil suit in appropriate state or federal court. That's what I'm suggesting.
I would like to know what our city attorney and our city manager think of changing. I understand what's, I'm a little bit nervous about anything that says five days because who knows what might be going on to prevent that? I'd like to know your opinion of changing G and what are the pros and cons
Uh, sure. It's a straight policy question so I'm going to decline to give it an A. Hard recommendation, but a little on pros and cons. If the city consent is required then that blocks straight filibus lawsuits because the city would not consent to those. The con of course is that it adds additional burden on staff and it adds an additional requirement to review presumably a draft complaint, review it, investigate it come to some conclusions about whether or not lawsuit makes sense and then consent to that, that adds additional staff time. That adds additional attorney time. That adds additional process when if the idea is to allow private enforcement, the city needn't do anything.
Someone else could enforce it. And if the city saw the case as a problem we would enforce it on our own. Presumably the city would be enforcing already so that's the other side of that. And then on switching it for notification instead, if it's notification then the city's not gatekeeping the right of the residents to go to court Which is one of our more fundamental rights. So we're not gatekeeping that, which would be something to consider as well.
Manager?
So that's a thorough legal explanation. Let me just give you some very plain, straight talk. This is a policy decision. You can decide whatever you want and we're going to follow your direction because that's what we do. From an operational perspective this clause could go away and it wouldn't impact what we're doing on the operations side one bit. It does not help us. It's not a tool in the toolkit that we need or necessarily want.
So it's a policy decision. If you want to have that in there, great but it's not going to help us turn the tide as far as enforcement of short-term rentals. You already did that when you gave us an additional resource that we're gonna come back and give you some suggestions on. That's gonna turn the tide. That's gonna be the big item as well as the provisions for penalties and ill-gotten gains that you gave us. That is the huge part. This?
It's a policy decision if you want it fine doesn't help us from an operation side
So I'm going to go ahead and get started. Thank you very much.
3:17 – 3:235 turns
tipping the scales towards people who had money for lawsuits. You know, basically we're allowing an immense amount of power for someone to go after a neighbor And the point of the clause was to sort of put some sort of gatekeeper on that. Now, as far as staff time we appropriated or are going to appropriate a staff member for enforcement So as far as burdening staff, that will be the job of that particular person that we agreed to hire.
The other thing is this doesn't have to do with neighbor-to-neighbor. I could live in Massachusetts, you know and decide that I wanted to cause some trouble to somebody I want to cause trouble to. I mean this isn't so it could be neighbor-to-neighbor but it is so broad and it is it is so you know potentially punitive and as like I say if someone who is sitting a year and a half into a frivolous lawsuit I would not wish that on anybody.
And this allows neighbors who are angry at each other, it allows people to live in different cities who are angry at people to move forward at will. So if I'm an attorney, if I have a son as an attorney, if I have money, it puts a whole advantage to me and the one thing that stops it is an analysis by the enforcement agency. And we're hiring somebody for enforcement For me, it only makes sense that we also protect people against bad actors. And there isn't a huge protection. It isn't a huge protection. It's just an analysis that would stop frivolous lawsuits.
You know, people who engage in lawfare engage in lawfare. And it puts people who are the recipients of lawfare at a terrible, terrible disadvantage. So and I don't even know what a five-day notice means so I send a five day notice to Lucas and I say, I'm gonna do this. And if I don' send a five day notice...I don't even know what that means really So anyway, that's really all I have to say on that matter really. We need to protect people. It doesn't cause any detrimental effect to the people who want to sue rightly or who have a real case. It doesn't in any way affect their ability to do that but at the same time it does protect someone who is Potentially becoming a victim of lawfare
If
I could speak exactly because I yeah, I am with you But this line right here should defendants in suit prevail They may they may not recover attorneys fees or costs unless reviewing court of company So basically this protects this. This is that that What's the word I'm trying to use? This is the protection that a person would have. So if someone from Massachusetts sues you for suspecting that you have a short-term rental or brings a suit just out of animosity, that individual could prove That they are not having a short-term rental and therefore could recover all the costs.
So if we add the time limit, like some kind of time limit for the city to respond that takes away I mean, a lot of attorneys who are going to be presenting these cases are public interest attorneys who are probably working on contingency for not a lot of money. I'm thinking about a neighbor who is next to a party house And it's definitely a short-term rental, and that person might not have a lot of resources to go after somebody or might not even know about the legal ramifications or the statute of limitations. So I think the protection works both ways. But this clause right here is that protection for those to avoid frivolous lawsuits. Let's
take turns because we still, okay. I do have a specific response to that. Judges decide how much attorneys get. The judge can decide that a reasonable fee is half of what it costs. The judge can decide that a reasonable fee is 25% of what it costs. So there is nothing that requires a judge to agree to 100% of what it costs.
I do see your card, we already, you have to get the card in before, we already started discussion? Yeah. Well there were no cards.
3:23 – 3:287 turns
Mayor and Council, if there's just one you could certainly take it. It's not unreasonable but I would note for those wondering for the consent items like this that are pulled off consent we take the consent cards at the beginning of consent no cards were submitted on consent so no card was submitted but it's reasonable to take one comment
Thank you, Mayor. I just had a thought about the staff time issues so it seems like there are two options so one is that the city would have to consent to any lawsuit that staff would have to review the brief and then decide whether they consent. The other option That five days before the lawsuit the attorneys would present the brief to staff and then staff would presumably review the lawsuit and Decide whether to allow it through so it's the same amount of staff time The only difference is now the staff has to do it in five days instead of a reasonable amount of time It seems like it's more burden for staff. That's all thank you
mayor pro tem
Yeah,
so I actually practice in an area of law that has a provision providing for attorneys' fees. And there's a couple of things that need to be pointed out, so this would be what is considered to be a statutory cause of action if it was brought as a lawsuit. And under the rules of pleading to bring a statutory cause of action, you have to state every fact your claim is based upon with factual specificity.
So you can't just file a lawsuit and say, this person was bad. This person violated our ordinance. It would have to say, this person violated the ordinance in this manner and give specification of dates and times and things that would then be potentially subject proof. And the provision I'm thinking of has no type of a check and balance other than the judge is going to read and determine whether factual specificity has been provided in the complaint. If it hasn't been provided, The lawsuit goes away.
So I agree with the mayor that the provision, the final sentence, agree with Council Member Lange that the final sentence which says that a reviewing court can decide that the lawsuit was frivolous and thereby award attorney's fees is going to deter any attorney from taking a lawsuit on a flyer. I think an attorney is going to only want to take out a meritorious lawsuit because that's the only way they're compensated and so, Removal of this consent provision gets the city out of potentially becoming embroiled, puts the burden on the person who brings the lawsuit to come up with the facts.
And if they don't come up with the facts they potentially get penalized with an award of attorney's fees. And I think that's adequate protection. So if you're going to put, I don't think, I would just strike the with city consent language and say any aggrieved person so there's another thing you know somebody from some other state can't claim that they're an aggrieved person for a short-term rental violation in Ojai. You'd have to show that you are aggrieved, meaning you have a stake, you're somehow being impacted by the fact that the violation is taking place.
So I mean, I would suggest simply striking the language With city consent and saying any aggrieved person or entity may bring a civil suit in an appropriate state or court. And that's exactly how the statute that I work with on a regular basis reads.
Would you like to go ahead make a motion?
Yeah, I move that we strike the words from Section 4 Subdivision G, we strike the words with city consent. And otherwise adopt the ordinance? And otherwise adopt the ordinance.
3:28 – 3:3626 turns
Can I can ask a question It was your first Comment adding the time limit to that. It was your first so mayor pro tem Whitman's Motion is to strike that all together and your original proposal was to add a time limit to it five days prior If
they notify this notify notifies the city five days prior to Bringing the suit
I Will second it and um, and I just want to bring our attention one more time to The sentence that mr. Summers said at the last meeting The last sentence he's referring to the last sentence in subsection G of the present language in part is protection against a frivolous or meritless lawsuit in that a defendant who was subjected to a suit is That the court found frivolous and lacks any merit would recover attorney's fees.
So we have a motion and we have a second, are you ready for roll call?
No
I just wanted
a couple of responses. City Attorney who was the guy that we were in a lawsuit with for a year who was an attorney who claimed that there was an illegal split lot
That would be Mr. Tully.
Mr. Tully, and Mr. Tully was able to do that and spend $80,000 and cost the city $80 thousand because he was a lawyer. And from what I understood, he never had a case but it didn't matter because he was aggrieved and he was a lawyer and he just kept it going on and on because he could right? And he was mad We
filed a lawsuit, we got it killed on Demur after a couple rounds of briefing. The trial court agreed with us and dismissed the case and he didn't appeal.
Correct. And from what I understood from the city manager at the time, James Vega, that it cost us about $80,000. It was ongoing. Oh my God, I forget the exact price tag. Yeah, well that's what he said. It was about $80 thousand. Plus
council
time. Yeah. Plus our time for something that had no merit. According to Mr. Vega. That is the City's
position in that case had no
merit. Yeah, that was the City's position but yet we had no choice. And that is the same situation that I am just trying to stop. I'm not saying that everybody is that way. We've done everything we can possibly do to make someone who has an illegal short-term rental feel the pain. But the flip side of that is, is that someone can make someone else feel that pain because they want to and as far as going to court Once again, yes you can go to court and yes it can be thrown out of court.
But it was nine months before my court case came in front. We're talking... You don't just file a case and you go the next day and the judge says okay this is frivolous we're going to give you all your money. It's motion after motion expense after expense appeal after appeal why wouldn't we put in some sort of protection for our residents who might be on the receiving end. It costs us nothing, we're hiring an enforcement officer.
I just don't see the downside of protecting people who might be on the receiving end of someone who was angry Like, Mr. Tully was angry and he was an attorney and he just kept going. He didn't have to pay any money. He just kept going.
I would note as to the Tully lawsuit that statute does not have a frivolous law suit result in attorney's fees for the defendant. City never gets attorney's fees.
That's not really my point. My point is that it didn't cost him anything. No one was going to get... He
spent his time,
yeah. Anyway, in the end it's going to be a policy decision of the Council but I would I would hope that we would put up some sort of protection against a bad actor, and it's not a big protection for gosh sakes. It doesn't even have to be that needs consent. It could just be an analysis by the office. That would carry a huge amount of weight if it just went in and the enforcement officer said, We don't see it. That is a huge deterrent, and it doesn't have to be you read the brief. It's just like if someone filed a complaint and you looked at it and you said I don't see it.
That would end the problem right there because no one's going to go to court when the enforcement officer has said I don' see it
So now you're bringing up a bigger issue and that is if we have the part here about the city consent, could we be brought into the lawsuit? Say we have someone who, like the previous case that you just mentioned. If the City Council is involved in giving consent at all would that make us and we have two neighbors against each other and one is very litigious and using lawfare Could then we be sued or could we, what would that, is there a risk? Adding or
subtracting city consent doesn't necessarily increase or decrease the risk of the city being drawn on the lawsuit. I think the risk is always there because we're always at risk because we're the enforcement agency so the total example is not a great example on that front because that case is directly, he was challenging a city action. He had to sue
the city.
Here, the plaintiff could choose to sue just a neighbor. They could choose to sue the neighbor and the city. The city can't be held liable for its enforcement decisions. We have absolute immunity on prosecutorial immunity to decide when to enforce and when not to enforce so that case we would kick quickly although as noted we rarely get defense fees So we might see sort of the city consent piece doesn't really affect that risk that risk is always there
Mayor Pro Tem
But if the city engages in a consent or a refusal of consent, city can be drug into court on a writ of mandate to challenge the decision either to consent or not consent. Which means that the city would then incur attorney's fees based upon the consent.
Yeah, somebody could always sue to challenge the refusal to consent and argued that was somehow lacking adequate basis in law. There is that risk, yes. That's
true. Through the mayor? I'm going to make a comment. I would argue that the language is already in subsection G, the protection against a frivolous lawsuit in the last sentence. And once again, the reasoning here is to remove roadblocks So we do have a motion and a second, so let's go ahead. I'd like to make a substitute motion. I'm going to finish my sentence. After we have final comments,
3:36 – 3:4319 turns
I'd like to make a substitute motion that we don't look for consent to further the lawsuit, but that we require an analysis of enforcement by the enforcement officer whom we are hiring for this. We're planning on, you know, we're planning to extend our staff to deal with enforcement. I never really assumed that we would look at someone who, that we would actually read the briefs. I'm just saying that an analysis by the city staff of the complaint would be in order and once again I will point out that going to court, the simple act of going to court regardless of the findings is a burden.
And it is a stressful operation maybe not for a lawyer. But for neighbors who are aggrieved, it is not just simply you show up to court and the judge finds in your favor. That is not the experience of the normal person who is being sued. Believe me.
Okay
so we have a motion.
It's adopt the ordinance.
No, what I want is I want the people who want to sue to come not that you need permission to move forward but that you need an analysis by the city enforcement officer. So maybe you have to bring it to the city first. I just want someone impartial to be able to give an evaluation of whether or not this suit is legitimate, someone whose job it is to enforce this which would be the community development. In the end it's gonna be what it's gonna be but
Is there a second for this motion? Wait, is there a second for that motion? Okay. All right we're going to go back to the first. We have a motion on the table. So if our
mayor had not brought up item G, we would have just passed it until we had this. We didn't see anything wrong with that item. I wrote this reflecting the council's
policy choices. At the last meeting had the mayor not pulled it from consent It would have been approved with the rest of that consent calendar exactly as approved at the last meeting Of course, the mayor raised a policy question and we need a policy direction
Is simply to remove With city consent, that's all. There was nothing about five days, correct?
Correct.
And then we were told that it actually doesn't make any difference whether we keep that wording in or not if I understood what you said.
It makes a lot of difference.
It removes the consent
part.
There is a significant difference. City consent or not consent. If the city consent is required for a lawsuit to go forward, then an aggrieved person cannot go to court without the city consenting. So that's the difference. It's whether or not the city is a gatekeep on the way to court, or whether or not the city is a protection for people who would be the defendants. There are two ways to look at it.
The alternative language proposed by Mayor Pro Tempore is to delete the city consent so an aggrieved person can file a lawsuit The other, third option we're up to now, language by Councilman Rule would be not city consent but require before you go to court, you have to present the complaint to the city. The city produces an analysis of it and that analysis has to be filed together with a complaint to court. But the person can go to court on their own without city consent. So in that regard they collapse back to the same. The difference is whether the city analysis is included or not included but still not gatekeeping the way to court.
And the original language would require city consent before I can go to court
We have a motion and we have a second. I think it's time to call the question and have a roll call. I do
have just one question. To the Mayor, is your concern that it is going to cause City staff time.
Is that your concern? As I said, I think that we have in this ordinance language and you know, I'm quoting Mr. Summers that we are protecting people from a frivolous lawsuit. And so I think it's to save staff time and to streamline it. So let's go ahead and vote and we can.
It's a policy question. Yeah, I still have one comment here A frivolous lawsuit, getting the determination of a frivolous lawsuit takes a lot of time and a lot of money and you may not get it all back. That is very true. And that is very true, it's not just a frivolous lawsuit and you don't ever make it to court. That isn't what happens. So I just want people to realize that as you vote.
It's huge. What is wrong with the staff making a determination?
3:43 – 3:4921 turns
Okay
roll call on Council Member Ruhl's motion please.
Are you gonna ask me?
Roll-call vote Passed Moved by Leslie Rule · Seconded by Suza Francina
Show transcript
And so I'm more comfortable with the wording city staff than a specific staff. It's going to be the appropriate city staff, right?
Yeah, leave it at city staff that will be assigned as needed.
And so to my consent and analysis and consent would include analysis. I mean, I'm happy to use the word analysis.
I'm having a difficult time knowing how that process would work. If you can present a case, no matter what. So if there's no barrier to presenting a case but we need to have staff provide an analysis And I think that's really important.
Before an enforcement officer that we have actually going to hire to do this So the staff argument to me just kind of dissolves because we're hiring someone to do all of this new enforcement So this would just be a very small added Portion of what that enforcement officer that we've agreed to hire. You would just simply bring you would have to file with the city and A violation.
You would have to complain, you would have to do a code enforcement violation first and the city would have to actually look at that first and make a determination And I'm not saying that would stop you from going ahead. If you wanted to file that lawsuit, go ahead. The city is not a gatekeeper stopping in my mind, stopping the lawsuit, right? But it is, you need to come in and get a determination and put that in or give it to the defendant.
You know, however that works. It's just, that to me is the cleanest, simplest, most streamlined way to keep lawfare under control is you come in and you get a determination. And the code enforcement, who's making the complaint? Who are they complaining against? Both parties get the findings. So if you choose to move forward And it validates, you know, enforcement says we didn't see anything here. Then the defendant has something that they can use and it will also give pause to someone who might be inclined to do lawfare because it doesn't really cost them anything for whatever reason that might be. They have more money, it doesn't matter to them, they're an attorney, their children have friends that are attorneys I just don't see what the downside of that is.
We're hiring the person to do enforcement, why is it only enforcement to penalize? Why isn't it also enforcement to protect?
Okay, I'm gonna call the question. Could we have the roll call please? Thank you.
That's how I see it.
Roll-call vote Failed 1–3 Moved by Andrew Whitman · Seconded by Betsy Stix · 1 under review
Show transcript
Okay, we will
go
back to the original motion. Do you mind repeating that?
Yes. So we had a motion by Mayor Pro Tem Whitman seconded by Mayor Sticks to adopt the ordinance as recommended with an amendment to section 4-24.05 subsection G to strike the words with city consent.
Roll call.
Roll-call vote Passed 3–1 motion by Mayor Pro Tem Whitman seconded by Mayor Sticks to adopt the ordinance as recommended with an amendment to section 4-24.05 subsecti · 1 under review
Show transcript
Motion passes 3-2. Okay
thank you all right we will go on to the council members reports anyone have anything to report? Anyone? Well, I would like to say congratulations to Krotona for the centennial celebration. It was a really wonderful weekend, great turnout and what a great resource and to our community and such a beautiful place so I encourage everybody to go up there and take advantage of their classes and their beautiful surroundings Also, I saw Deer at the Art Center. So congratulations to the Art Center for a great production, very weird and wonderful.
We'll see. And also the World Dance Festival, I wasn't there because I was seeing Deer but I heard it was really spectacular and sold out crowd so congratulations to them. Anybody else?
I don't need to repeat here things that I've discussed with you, right?
Okay. City Manager's report?
No report Mayor.
Okay all right well thank you all for productive very productive meeting and we are adjourned