Planning Commission Regular Meeting

It's 6 o'clock, and I'm calling the Planning Commission meeting of September 2nd, 2026 to order. Could we have a roll call please?

To the flag of the United

States of America, and to the republic for which it stands, one nation under God, indivisible with liberty and justice.

Is there anyone here wishing to address the public communications portion of the meeting? That would be communications that are not agendized. I have no cards. Is there anyone online, Sherry? No. OK, we will close public communications and move to the consent calendar. We have the minutes of the Planning Commission of August 19th Are there any changes or problems with that agenda?

OK. In that case, the minutes will be approved as distributed. Disclosure of site visits and ex parte contacts

I've visited both sites that we were discussing today, but just briefly today.

No expertise?

No conversations. I previously visited the Flowers Amongst the Cottages but have not visited the other sites.

No ex parte and did not visit the sites.

Okay, I have visited the site of the cottages among the flowers previously Drove by it today And I have driven by the other site we'll be looking at The Planning Commission is going to be reviewing a The approved phasing plan and consider an adjustment to the cottages among the flowers. Could we have a staff report on that, please?

Hold on. I have to recuse myself. I live within 500 feet of the project.

Thank you.

All right. Good evening, my name is Lucas Seibert. I'm the Community Development Director here for the City of Ojai. The item you have before you tonight is a review of progress report for the Cottages Among the Flowers and more specifically the consideration of phase four construction concurrent with phase two. And this might sound familiar, because this actually was a project that came before this body basically almost a year ago to the day where this body considered this matter.

I would say during that meeting and knowing that we have a new commissioner, I probably should walk through the project, the phasing, a little bit of the history. I think all that information is provided within the staff report. Just going to give kind of an overview I'd like to do something called setting the table for the discussion. And then as a public hearing, we do need to open this up for public discussion to allow for the community to speak and then you can close that public hearing and then deliberate.

Let's start with the staff report and just kind of an overview. Up on the screen here is the four phases to the cottages, so the cottages was a project that was approved by City Council in 2007, and then the phasing aspect to this project was approved by Planning Commission, this body, in 2009. There were conditions in both instances that are together a part of the project. There was conditions for the construction of the project, and then there was conditions for the phasing of the project. Within the phasing of the project was a condition number 27 that specifically identified prior to consideration of phase four. I'm paraphrasing this. It's to come before this body as scheduled as a public hearing. So we are following that condition for consideration tonight.

On the screen are the four phases. The first phase is the phase that was recently completed and is identified within the yellow highlighted area, and if I can take my cursor and kind of show you there's two buildings that were a part of this phase. And then as a part of the settlement agreement There are two ADU style building or units that are on top of this five-car garage that you're seeing here.

So the yellow is the highlighted for phase one, the green is the highlighted area for phase 2 which has and is currently under construction right now so that area is here Phase three, which has not started

yet

because it requires phase two to be in full completion is highlighted in blue. And then the area that you're seeing here in red is phase four. Now phase four is the one that's up for consideration and discussion tonight. Phase one included four units, phase two includes three units for renovation. Three also includes three units and then four includes two units.

So what this body is up for discussion tonight is taking phase two, which is in the green and having that go concurrent with phase four. In 2025 when this first came forward as a discussion item, I believe it was in September of 2025 The ask was basically the same with a slight caveat. They had initially looked at doing access for utilities along Aliso, after this body considered the matter and approved it they realized that in doing so There was no way that they could connect utilities to Aliso, that the only way that the utilities could be connected would be along and through Oak Street. So once they realized that, that would cut directly through phase three which was a non-starter. So essentially they had abandoned that approval recognizing that that would require an additional review by this body and potentially other changes for consideration.

So that was withdrawn, but interesting enough there was also an appeal that was filed around that same time. And the appeal was dismissed challenging the phase four piece to that puzzle. So tonight for consideration is looking at taking phase four and basically having that run concurrent with phase two. So that's pretty much it. I should mention the settlement agreement. So the settlement agreement was a part of a bigger project. This is one piece to a four-piece, basically four slices to the pie.

Those other projects, one in particular is just north of here as a part of that settlement agreement which is Mallory Way. There's a project off of Montgomery that was included in that settlement agreement, as well as one on East Ojai Avenue. Those are not for discussion. That was put in this report so that you as the body were aware of that settlement agreement as it exists.

With that, if the commission has any questions I could certainly answer them.

So the phasing plan which was agreed to by the Planning Commission in 2008? Correct. Was part of the settlement coming up with a phasing plan?

The settlement agreement came forward in 2023. This project has been going on for... So the phasing

plan was just part of the original project approval?

Correct, so there was the approval by City Council in 2007 and then the phasing plan which is approved by this body in 2009. And then a long period before we ended up getting into a settlement agreement, essentially. There was a legal battle that was going on as well off and on.

The settlement didn't touch any of the phasing that had been pre-approved? It sort of

just carried that with it? No, it was basically saying to carry out the projects that have been identified. Cottages, Mallory Way, South Montgomery, East Ojai.

Would you explain to us, or perhaps you would like Mr. Becker to explain to us the need to make this change?

If I could have Jeff or Vim come up and speak to the ask.

Good afternoon, planning commissioners and city staff. There's a couple of reasons why we'd like to move forward with it. One is that the system that we're using for these two units, the Samara units, it has an interesting ground frame system which is the foundation system. It's a pinned foundation system. which has not been done here locally and frankly we haven't done it.

It's been permitted and submitted to the state, and it's been permitted by the city already so one of the main reasons we want to do it is to actually install and try the system out for these two units because the fourth project Lucas mentioned Mallory Way has 20 plus of these units that's going to be installed and we're not quite sure how this is going to work with our Ojai land given the rocky terrain. So, that's one of the main reasons. The second issue is that we have two of the Summer units are completed Most people haven't seen those locally.

We'd like to install and drop those on the units, and give everybody an example of what the larger project will end up looking like because that'll be in front of the council at some point in the next six months. The third thing, Lucas if you could bring the map up of the site? So the kind of the pink shaded area there, this is on the original approvals with a very large duplex. That pink shaded area is a fire lane.

Part of phase two requires that we complete the fire lane by the Fire Department. So those are pavers, that's a whole paving system so it doesn't make any construction sense for us to go in finish the fire lane with phase two which is these three units here And then rip it up. So we've already sleeved underneath the improvements, the common improvements that we did over the last 18 months so we can do that top end but to put in the rest of the system and the parking and then rip it up which is ultimately what we'd have to do.

So that's another issue. In our plan or ask Is that we stub in the utilities underneath these units, but we're not going to hook these things up Until we're done with phase three Because all the utilities that are coming in or coming in off the east side of the property through the middle of phase three You know, we have to trench through there. So some of that trenching will be occurring for phase two But we won't be completing that until we get to phase three so those are the basic reasons and You're

trenching for phase three and two at the same time?

No, two.

For two?

Phase 2, yeah. All the water, one of the reasons we stopped previously after we got approval about a year ago was that our original approvals and discussions with the Water District, Casitas was going to have the water systems for phase 4 off of Aliso. They were going to go along that. Right. That area and I'm not sure if you I sent that scan of the utility I Sent it to Sherry

that wasn't included in there.

Okay anyway, those are utility map but originally we thought the utilities were going to come off of off of Aliso and unfortunately the engineers wouldn't approve that because there's Issues with that line, too many T's off of it in that area. So the water lines will all come off of the end of Oak over here on this side, on the phase three side.

Have residents moved into phase one?

Yeah, the first two. First two we're just starting with the two ADUs at present.

And do you anticipate filling phase two before starting with residents before starting phase three?

Probably, or it'll be in conjunction with that.

Dust seems to be a very large issue for the residents in that area. Are you able to do anything beyond wetting the ground down to keep that from driving everybody crazy?

Well, it is a construction site. And we are doing our watering a couple times a day. It's tough, especially at this point. We've had a crazy hot summer so it is a tricky deal. Most of the heavy grading and all that has been done. And that's one of the other reasons why we went to the Samara units not only for this site but also for the larger units because those can be installed without all kind of crazy grading that you normally would have to do, besides the fact that they're built offside. So you have the less noise and you don't have the pneumatic hammers all the things that come along with construction.

Could you explain a little bit more about what the foundation is? You mentioned a pin foundation, but I don't know what

that is. Yeah, it's called a ground frame system. So it's like large pins that are driven in to the ground different sizes depending on the size of the unit. And so these are drilled into the ground at different angles And then they are tied together above ground with a metal pan system. And then your unit sits on top of it.

What's the reason for going in at angles?

Is that earthquake? Yeah, engineering, earthquake, engineering.

Do you have any questions for Jeff? You covered

initially, I think.

You were mentioning how for phase two, this red line from. Is that the water course or is that a road you were saying? That kind of starts on Aliso and then...

Yeah, that's the road. The kind of the pink area. And then the storm channel is kind of to the east of that just up against it.

So can you clarify that because the diagram looks like it's a part of phase four I guess but you were saying it's part of phase two.

Oh, yeah. The fire department has required that be completed before phase two units are occupied.

All the way to the end or just at the end of phase

two? They've all the way to the end where the turnaround is. I don't know if you can see it on your map here. There's a Deadman there for fire.

Uh-huh. Yeah. And I guess if we had the utility plan, we'd see where those lines were coming through there.

Is that the deal?

I've

got staff making copies of these so that the community can see this as well

Utilities General at the site, you know that's reliving the utilities of the 30s and The electrical feeds were also feeding some of the neighbors overhead So those are all being put underground phase one is already all underground But the rest of the phases obviously will all be underground

How will you be bringing or from where are you bringing the summary units in is that going to be on the

So that's another-

On that road from Aliso.

That's a great question because that's another one of the reasons why we want to do it. These things are installed with a massive crane, and so they're lifted up. And so we've had their crane operators that are used to dealing with some of our units, and it'll probably come in off the vacant lot side to the north off of Mallory Way. It can stretch, I think it's 140 feet.

But that's where they'll be coming in and dropping it.

So it really won't impact the cottages among

the flowers? No, there's not enough. You couldn't get a crane in there at this point.

OK.

I have a question about the Summer units. The external finishing of them will be similar to the older style cabins?

Yeah, on these two units it's cement fiber siding but yeah, it's a wood siding appearance. But they meet all state fire codes and all that.

OK, but they blend in with the other.

I had the opportunity to go and view the Summer units last year when we were looking at this, and they were really very nice. Great.

Cool.

Any other questions for Jeff? Not at this time? Not yet. OK. Thank you, Jeff. At this point, I will open the public hearing. And I have a card from Anita Cram

Good evening. So I have a couple of comments from the beginning. First is that pavers do not need to be put down for a fire truck to get down that road, you know there's fire truck access on it currently. Second is drilling into the ground is going to be no less intrusive than what they're doing now to phase two So this is going to be a tremendous burden on the people living in the neighborhood, not just those at the cottages. People are already at breaking point from all of the noise, the trucks, the disruptions.

And that's why the phasing was set a long time ago was to keep in mind of the impact that this was going to have on the neighborhood. These cottages, in the conditions of approval it says that a professional historian is one who has to make the decisions about. It's in the conditions of approval for the Cottages Among the Flowers that they are the ones who have to make the decisions about whether or not anything that's done at the cottages matches them historically because remember these cottages are eligible for federal state and local historic landmark status Due to the loss of that, there are mitigations and one of them is that a professional historian must be involved in making decisions. That professional historian is the only one who can decide if these Samari units are comparable to the history of the cottages.

In addition, the settlement agreement This is being proposed to use as a test for Mallory Way. But Mallory Way, as the developer said, is project number four in the scope of all four of them so there's plenty of time between... There's no need to rush phases to have that particular You know, models sitting there for a while before they actually get to even being able to do it at Mallory Way. And in addition the settlement agreement that Lucas mentioned of 2023 has specific language about the interior of the Mallory Way bungalows so the approval of these Summer units at Mallory Way was illegal In the context of the settlement agreement, because that's a binding agreement. And the only people who can change that are the signatories and the Planning Commission nor the Development Director are a signatory to that agreement.

So that is a big problem for the city that they broke the conditions of approval or I'm sorry, they broke the settlement agreement when this body approved Summer units for Mallory Way. They're not a signatory. They can't do that. And the language is very specific. I sent it in as part of my comments. The language is very specific in the settlement agreement about Mallory Way and what can and cannot be done in those units. So all of those are moot, all of those approvals of Summer Units. And the development director should have never approved by decree that he could make a significant change from ground built up Homes for cottages among the flowers to these Summer units because again, the conditions of approval. This is a CEQA mitigated negative declaration It is required due to the loss of historic resources that these things be considered So there's a lot of problems with this and I think you're putting you know The city and everyone in jeopardy by moving forward when all of this has been broken In the process in the way, this is gone and the neighborhood really needs consideration on you guys just deciding to do these two Units concurrently it they won't be happy.

Thank You Anita Is there anyone else in the audience who wishes to speak to this issue I Have you filled out a card, sir? I would. Is there anyone online? No. OK. Then we'll wait for this gentleman. Thank you, sir. Ellen, what is your last name?

According to this documentation of the Melhoff me HL h a ff

Thank you.

I have several names and aliases. Thank you So the only question that I have about the proposed Four stages is I'm a little confused on the pictures The pictures only are showing it looks like construction diagrams are not given me an interpretive feel of The the area and the different things like it doesn't show windows. It doesn't show that the bushes it doesn't show termite Infestation or bugs cockroaches dirt debris leaves any of that other stuff? Thank you for having me speak

Thank You Alan Okay, I see no other people wishing to speak so I am going to close the public hearing and Bring the discussion back to the Commission Do you have any questions at this point?

Lucas, can you respond to some of the Items that were brought up in about the historian Anita's yes comments both about the history the unit choice and approval So

if you're looking at the so there's a couple things that I'm not necessarily on the line with in terms of what she's identifying. And then these were also brought up in 2025, so because of the multiple questions and comments that were provided by the community we put together an FAQ. That FAQ is attached to this. I don't know if you remember but at the end of that meeting when you made a determination I had made the promise that I would put together an FAQ So that is included in here as well to kind of help inform the review and process overall. Speaking specifically to, like for instance, the settlement agreement from 2023, it has a lot of different pieces to the puzzle of that four pieces of property throughout the city as a part of the settlement agreement for and working with Becker, obviously approved by City Council.

The conditions of approval specifically if you look at those, you see the conditions of approval from 2007 that specifically identify and were approved by City Council Then you also see the conditions of approval that were a part of the phasing plan, which requires the triggering of review by this body if Phase 4 is being considered. It also has language in there that speaks to the completion of Phase 3. Well here, Phase 3 isn't even being considered simply because we are still working on or the developer's still working on Phase 2.

In terms of process and procedure, the reason why it's before you is that specific condition, Condition 27 calls for this body to review and consider the progress report and then Phase 4. So because Phase 4 is being leapfrogged, it's before this body for consideration. That's the first piece. The second piece is the historian piece. There is a specific condition, she is correct through the mitigation that was a part of this project there is the requirement for historian.

It's my understanding that the developer has a contracted historian that is in constant review. I know we have in-house conditions of approval compliance officer That is out there regularly monitoring and making sure that the conditions of approval for the entire project, including both the phasing conditions as well as the conditions that were approved by city council in 2007 are adhered to.

So yes, all those pieces are in play.

I understand that Mallory Way is landmarked. Is there-

Hold on, hold on.

Is there anything similar for cottages?

Mallory Way is not landmarked.

The 25 units or something like

that are? It's being considered for landmarking, yes. This body as well as the Historic Preservation Commission had reviewed Mallory Way and then forwarded their recommendations to city council. So right now it's sitting and waiting for review by city council.

OK. Is there anything similar going on at the cottages

In terms of?

Historical. Landmarking, review. Is there any consideration?

Yeah, the site is not landmarked, does not contain a Mills Act. But through the M&D that was prepared for this project and certified in 2007 by city council, it does identify a number of conditions as mitigation to not moving forward with a landmark ultimately.

And have those mitigations all been met

Yeah, they're working on those mitigations as we go along. Now I would have to check in with the compliance officer to see what the progress report is on those. I know he's working on that kind of independently.

Jeff, do you have anything to add at this point?

Yeah, we have a plethora of consultants that are involved. So you know we have RENCON consultants and their historian as part of the project. We just had them out there last week in 105 degree weather reviewing phase two including all of our work that's going to be involved in phase two All of you guys are happy to go take a look at it. It's they're sitting on stilts Two of the phase two of those units that are in phase two So yes, we do have a consultant the city's code compliance officer Eduardo is out there probably twice a week Just doing his site visits so okay Thank You

The implication was also that there is some relation to the historian and the approval of the Samara units. So can you maybe give us a little more clarity on

that? So the Summer units were approved as part of a director's exemption, so let me just walk you through what that process looks like. So the director's exemption provides for projects that don't warrant planning commission or city council review to be done At staff level the interesting thing about how these directors exemptions operate is notification is provided to the Planning Commission as well as City Council as required by Essentially a policy that was adopted in 2019 and So, the Summer units are smaller in size than the two units that you're seeing up there for phase four. They're in the five to 700 square foot range and the reduction of those saves a number of trees on site so we saw them as being smaller consistent with the overall development for the cottages And then the fact that they were saving a number of trees that were on site.

Obviously, the trees have grown over the last 15-18 years so those trees that may not have been considered to be mature now qualify as mature protected trees. The historian piece I'd have to look at that condition again but I know we have well not we but The developer has a historian under contract on site doing regular check-ins. I'm not sure how regular those are, but

Do they prepare reports and submit them to the city, or

is there a process? Yeah. I haven't had them preparing reports but I do know they're making direct contact with Eduardo and our co-clients. I see. OK.

I was curious what extent the state bills, I think it's 35 and 330, had to do with the development because it looks like that bill really puts a lot of pressure for more housing units

You're talking about SB 330 and SB 35, which are basically ministerial review processes as it relates to affordable housing. And just basically multifamily development. And that's not involved? No, neither one of those applications are applicable here.

I'd like to ask an unrelated question, but it came to my attention in attachment F page 3 of 8. This is regarding the existing drainage ditch or small river however you want to look at it And it indicates that there should be a report to be done for this. What is the status of applying for the lake and stream bed alteration program, and to the fish and wildlife, a separate application?

Has that been completed? Are we clear on the protection of that drainage ditch?

Yes, Judy we have a another consultant Pax Environmental that is working with Fish and Game on a We have an application already but they're working on a Mitigation review I guess I'd call it for lack of a better word. So In fact, I just got a copy of it yesterday the draft so they're reviewing it with the landscape Architect for the project which is Bill Mallett

What kind of mitigation would that be

It's basically I would say They're summarizing what we have done already, but they also which is the planting of local wildflower seeds But they're also looking at The Mallory Way side because of all the eucalyptus. And so with that project, that kind of grove of eucalyptus will be removed. Some of those will be or most of them will be removed because they're invasive. At least that's what the report is recommending.

If a grove of eucalyptus is removed how does that change the amount of water in the channel? The ditch?

I have no idea. It's way above my pay grade, so I'm not sure.

Will that be taken into account then in this final?

Yeah, that's part of their whole report.

And does that report come to the city?

Yeah, the city would be getting a copy of it. Yeah. Okay. Yep.

Thank you.

You're

welcome while you're up there Jeff I was hoping because obviously some of the concerns are about The intensity of work on this site. It's a main concern it seems like and so I was hoping you know You're talking a little bit of what's happening with phase two right now Which is that the buildings are lifted? There's excavation happening for the foundations all three are lifted to her lifted

Two of the three are lifted, the excavation's already done.

Excavations done?

Yeah those were done by hand too so

primarily by hand. Is the third one also need foundation new foundations?

Yeah it's there's a resident in that unit so ultimately when we get to that that'll be the same thing but See, yeah the the you know the Trenching and all that stuff Will occur at some point. You know once that resident has to relocate uh-huh

and so the So then the So basically you're moving into maybe forming and pouring foundations on those buildings okay, right and then I guess if this were to, well no. So then and then if this were to get approved what would sort of be can you kind of take us through the scope of work for the phase four zone just to understand what's kind of happening concurrently on these two areas?

With this system, the screws are basically screws. Just imagine a giant screw. These are drilled in with a pneumatic gun system so you don't have the kind of crazy lifting of dirt that would occur. So just by the nature of this design it's actually less of an intrusive sort of install that you would have with trenching down three to four feet

See you have to there's some tree removal though. That's first.

There's a tree removal Yeah, yeah one of the larger trees fell down last year unfortunately, okay But yeah, there's some tree removal still. Yeah, but it's a total different animal than that was originally approved back in 2007 we actually acquired this in 2014 just so you guys know and So one of the reasons we went with these units is, as Lucas noted, was the size. It's much more in keeping with what we have there with the units versus this massive duplex which basically was lot to lot.

Roughly how long does it take to put in the foundation for the Samaras? How

many? Well, the ground frame group told us two days. So that's a whole different animal than what we're used to experiencing. That's one of the main reasons why I'm in front of you So we want to try it out and see how it works and see if it's if it's viable. I mean, so I've seen it in person At another location but you know that's a different soil condition. So we want to see how it does here And this tomorrow units would just be dropped in. So these are two units those would be actually in one day

So is there any? So the trees need to be removed. Is there any other site grading that needs to happen before the pins go in?

Most of it's actually already been done in that area, yeah. This is up against kind of where we have a sort of temporary walkthrough So there'll be a little bit of removal, scrub and other things. But it won't be the kind of typical thing that you come in and have to do a lot of grading. We're not going to be doing that.

I like the idea of getting the landscaping started earlier with this proposal. Well,

they're still going to have a lot of site work to do around it after this. They're just going to kind of be sitting there waiting.

No, the landscaping was going to

start. They won't be occupied. You know, they'll just be sitting there as basically sort of like the unit that was in the parking lot. You saw

Maybe in response to Jews Comment is a question. Is it does it stop once the Samara phase forward? Does that work stop once the Summer units are dropped or is there other work that would then continue to happen? Well before that before the utility trenching

I think I read that you're going to do the landscaping

some of the landscaping we want to do to tie in the path and So, but that's actually a lot of that is part of phase two. So you know there's a whole path improvement that even gets done to the phase one right now It's it's just the existing one that was in place which has a gravel. Where's that?

It's the one it's above the road

You can kind of see this line here Oh

This path yeah, okay, okay Okay. And then, right, so then they're basically at that point theoretically they're sitting there on site waiting for the utility work to start once phase three begins. Which is six months out, a year out?

Probably a year out, maybe a little bit longer.

I guess then a couple of questions. What if, as you said, theoretically these pinned foundations should kind of go in pretty quickly? But you also don't know for sure so what- You know, what kind of What's the what's the is there like? What's kind of the backup or the you know because if we're sitting here like oh it's gonna be two days and then you know It's like three months four months for whatever reason probably not but like I think that could be

a one The one I looked at they did in a day. Yeah, so That was Santa Barbara County So

Did they have rocky soil?

I don't think it was as rocky as our soil. But yeah, they did have some rocks

What what do you do when you hit a rock

with this group shortened? They shorten the Those rods so he basically can work around rocks Oh, you know if they run into one they shorten it and they actually

Put it one another one in somewhere